Dardas Cast Bullets?

First topic message reminder :

These guys: http://www.dardascastbullets.com/

At their prices and the reported groups from PPC and bullseye shooters, I'm tempted to never cast my own again (at least in .38 & .45)

Anyone use 'em?

I'm impressed that the family has what you might call the precision accuracy pedigree.

Every barrel is different as to what it likes. I've seen barrels shoot everything good and others that were picky at 50 between 185 & 200 lswc. My longslide 45 likes everything. I built 2 identical pistols for 2 other guys and one is forgiving and the other one needs more powder to group. Can't just rely on other peoples advice, you have to shoot them. 
Jon

Jon Eulette wrote:Every barrel is different as to what it likes. I've seen barrels shoot everything good and others that were picky at 50 between 185 & 200 lswc. My longslide 45 likes everything. I built 2 identical pistols for 2 other guys and one is forgiving and the other one needs more powder to group. Can't just rely on other peoples advice, you have to shoot them. 
Jon

Jon:
 If you go to your mailbox some day & find 5 guns stuffed in the mailbox with a note to test, R&R as necessary, & retest, you will know who to send the bill & guns to.

Stupid touchpad ate my post.

Here we go again.

Wow. That was me starting this thread. Thanks for all the additional input and first-hand observations.

Although I can understand some OCD satisfying value in seeking bullets with very narrow weight distributions in each lot, the follow-up questions I want to ask are:

How do they shoot? Please quantify with group sizes at 50 yards, which separates the barely good from the truly good bullet/barrel combos.

How well does the fit/alloy/lube combination resist leading? Especially in revolvers. Yeah, I know that almost no one shoots the round gun in CF any more, but someone has to keep the "almost" alive. I'm not everyone, so might as well rejoice in being almost no one. Keep the variety alive. 

It is generally assumed that the fit (bullet diameter)prevents leading and accuracy by helping to keep the bullet straight in the bore.  The alloy and resulting hardness help by giving mechanical strength to the bullet to prevent deformation.  This works to allow higher pressures and velocities and really doesn't help much at normal bullseye velocities.  Lube or coatings help prevent leading by keeping the lead from contacting the bore.  It may also help prevent the lead from adhering to the steel so the next bullet scrapes the bore clean.  Exact mechanism of leading prevention of the lube is uncertain.  We know what works but I'm not sure we know why.

Sort out bullets by visual inspection, and then weigh them. It doesn't matter if two bullets have the same weight, if one has messed-up lube and the other has a horrible casting imperfection.

Keyholed wrote:Sort out bullets by visual inspection, and then weigh them. It doesn't matter if two bullets have the same weight, if one has messed-up lube and the other has a horrible casting imperfection.

+1

visual inspection really helps.. especially the base of the bullet

I just did a 32 piece sampling on my Dardas 200 gr SWC

they ran from 200.86-203.82. I'm currently sorting them into +/- .5 piles
(200.86-201.86, 201.87-202.87, 202.88-203.82).
currently the last two are running neck and neck.

I do everything within a 1 gr tolerance. For examples with 160's everything from 159.9 to 160.9 is one pile. Every thing from 161 to 162 is another and everything from 158.9 to 159.8 is a third. It worked pretty good. I do it that way because that's what Motorcycle Dan recommended for the long line with his 160's (which were not Dardas.).

Think the 802 from magnus is the 68 pattern
 His 801 is a button nose unique to him. A copy of the Remington 185 jswc. It does shoot at the LL.

I honestly think his cast bullets are the best in the business but, hey were both southerners so.......

jmdavis wrote:I do everything within a 1 gr tolerance. For examples with 160's everything from 159.9 to 160.9 is one pile. Every thing from 161 to 162 is another and everything from 158.9 to 159.8 is a third. It worked pretty good. I do it that way because that's what Motorcycle Dan recommended for the long line with his 160's (which were not Dardas.).

+/-.5 is 1 gr total tolerance.

Greetings,

Weight is not the only factor to consider.

Commercial cast bullets come from machines with multiple moulds. If they use eight blocks with two cavities, you have 16 different mould cavities.

If possible, obtain bullets "as cast, not greased". Now you can visually inspect them with the naked eye. It is easy to cull out the ones that did not fill the mould properly.

When I did a lot of hand casting, I culled the bullets with a micrometer. Any that were undersize (light) or oversize (heavy) were set aside or melted down.

I then weighed the "keepers" for grins. They all weighed within +/- 0.5 grains with a nominal weight of 160 grains.

I did purchase 2000 bullets unsized/ungreased from a commercial caster. The rejection rate was about the same as hand casting. The sorted ones shot okay while the ones with the obvious defects shot poorly.

The above commercial cast bullets had one or two moulds that were not aligning properly. The bullets measured 0.003" different on each side of the part line. When greasing, the lube would squirt past the part line.

Remember, once the bullet is sized and greased, all the defects are covered up.

Cheers,

Dave

Dave, for pistol it's easy to over think this. When I was shooting cast in IHMSA competition ( 79-83), I'd agree with you, but with large groove .45 bullets it's pretty easy to find the defective ones even lubed.

Greetings James,

I disagree. Once the bullet is sized and greased, you have no idea if it was cast undersize/oversize. Also, defects in the grease groove are impossible to see.

Additionally, weighing a greased bullet adds more variables. Are you checking the bullet or the amount of grease?

Most folks do not go to the extremes I do. However, most folks do not have access to a barrel tester as I do.

Speaking of barrel testers, I have tested barrels from several shooters that claimed the barrel was not accurate anymore. They are generally dumbfounded when I send them X-ring targets fired at 50 yards with "quality ammo" in their factory barrels.

Since I can no longer shoot well, I focus my energy on assembling X-ring ammo for those who can shoot well. I may be old; but, not dead (yet). The Ides of March are rapidly closing in.

Cheers,

Dave

I don't doubt your skills, nor your observations.

Cheers,

Jim