NRA, Use and abuse of our dollars

https://nraindanger.wordpress.com/2022/10/24/ny-suit-lapierre-files-his-answer/

Wouldn't Wayne LaPierre's reimbursements come from his salary as NRA director, also the same salary from our donations.  
 The last paragraph says everything. Just like all in his circle say : "We don't care, we don't have to".
 Stan

LaPierre really needs to go. He has shined a bad unwanted spot light on the NRA. I used to give to the NRA. Not anymore. I'm not contributing to his $2000 suits or his wife's spa visits.

Bill

The NRA Admin has not given a flip for members for a long time. They have treated vols and some (any they wanted to) employees unethicly for a long time also.

It's time for another "Cinncinn!ati"!!

Ron Habegger

Colt711 wrote:The NRA Admin has not given a flip for members for a long time. They have treated vols and some (any they wanted to) employees unethicly for a long time also.

It's time for another "Cinncinn!ati"!!

Ron Habegger

Another Cincinnati revolt?? to what end??

That revolt is what sowed the seeds of what we have now. It was cultivated very poorly.

IMHO

messenger wrote:LaPierre really needs to go. He has shined a bad unwanted spot light on the NRA. I used to give to the NRA. Not anymore. I'm not contributing to his $2000 suits or his wife's spa visits.

Bill

$2000 suits, that's funny. He's probably got track suits worth that much.

Leaving aside factual data lifted from legal documents and filings, I want to know who is the author of the non-factual comments and entire post overall.  While I'm in total agreement that it is time for LaPierre to retire (and for that matter at least half if not more of NRA Board of Directors), I want to state that his behavior is not out of the line.  It is rather modus operandi for many charitable organizations of NRA size, IMHO.  NRA just lucky to have bulls eye on its back.  And also, NRA did not even make in top 100 of charitable organizations in USA published by Forbes (every December?) on 12/16/21.

And it is not only USA specific phenomena.  And it is not started in April of 2019 with article published by The New Yorker regarding charges against NRA.  Great Britain has Charity Commission that provides very transparent information on the subject of investigating wrong doing by charities in UK.  Here is the link to press release going back almost ten years - https://www.gov.uk/government/news/charity-commission-names-further-charities-under-investigation  I am not aware of existence of any organization specifically tasked with investigating charitable organizations here in the USA like the one in UK.  

With that, it is IMHO, all this stink about LaPierre / NRA is triggered by gun control Nazis that are trying to obfuscate their real agenda and reasons for going after NRA.
Don't fall for it!

AP

I transitioned from hunting to Bullseye shooting, thus I receive the American Hunter magazine.

After I read where a writer was thanking all the NRA members for his paid hunt for Big Horn Sheep in Texas, I stopped contributing to the NRA. His hunt alone was $95,000.00. I would bet he received transportation expenses also.

Scott Olmsted, the editor of AH, and all his crony writers love to hunt in other countries at our expense. I stopped attending Friends of NRA banquets because I don't like contributing to their hunting trips.

Yes, usage of dollars needs to be addressed.   But one thing to remember is that the reason we have our sport at all is in no small part due to the NRA influence and information on political candidates.   So we need to be careful how we proceed lest the political power and influence wanes to nothing.  Which is exactly what several groups would like to see.  

Let's clean up what's needed, but don't throw stones or give any more stones to those that would like to see the demise of our major political resource.  In other words, complain all you can but make sure we don't fall in the trap of doing exactly what others would like to see happen.  

I can run matches, help get more people shooting, etc., but I can only cast one vote and I can't flex any political muscle individually to lobby politicians.  Just my personal opinion.

The NRA isn't a charitable organization as far as I know. It is being bombarded with legal action by left-wing, anti-gun politicians and organizations who want to crush it. It is the most influential organization for gun owners and needs to keep its place in the political arena. There have been a lot of abuses of funds and that needs to be stopped. There should be written guidelines for what should be spent and where. Wayne needs to step down because the BOD is very weak and is made up of people who don't want to rock the boat. The power of the NRA rests with a very few elite at the top. The NRA needs to be swept clean with a new broom. As a very long time member, I just don't know how that can be done.

"The NRA" is made up of several different entities.  

The NRA Foundation is a 501(c)(3) charitable organization
The NRA Civil Rights Defense Fund is a 501(c)(3) charitable organization.
501(c)(3)s are NOT allowed to lobby (among other things) but donations tend to be tax-deductible (at least that's the plan).

The National Rifle Association of America is classified as a 501(c)(4) tax-exempt "social welfare" organization which permits limited lobbying and political activity as long as those are not the primary activities of the organization.  Donations may or may not be tax deductible.

In exchange for tax exemption and the like, charitable organizations can face heightened scrutiny by various entities.  Boards of directors can be held to a higher standard than in the corporate world.  Certain activities are restricted as well.  It can get very complex very quickly.

[Although I learned this in a class on not-for-profit organizations in law school, this should not be considered legal advice. ;-) Nor does it really address the primary topic of the post....]

The NRA management should have been able to endure any audit and come out squeaky clean.  They could not do that, so now it's time to pay the piper.

PhotoEscape wrote:
....all this stink about LaPierre / NRA is triggered by gun control Nazis that are trying to obfuscate their real agenda and reasons for going after NRA.
Don't fall for it!

AP

One hundred percent correct, AP.

Jim

Kinda seems repetitive and kept in the family.

Wayne Lapierre and his top 12 cronies all take home million dollar plus salaries from the NRA, plus perks.  Thus we pay $20-30 million a year for NOTHING.  These thieves rob the membership blind and there is literally nothing we can do except stop funding these thieves.

I used to donate a firearm for a prize at Camp Perry, the deal was I'd do it for five years in memory of my Dad.  After the third year, the NRA demanded cash money.  They wanted cash and I could not stipulate who gets the award.  The idea being, I give them a $1000 dollars and they give away a single $50 dollar gift card to anyone they chose.  

My biggest complaint about the Nationals ws that they generate well over $500K a year and the NRA returns a few thousand dollars in prizes, shooters get little or no swag and are not treated very well by the NRA staff.  Crap like the Bianchi Cup generates less income and returns $50-100K in prizes.   I'm glad people are shooting anything, I just hate the idea that for years the NRA was milking the conventional pistol and rifle shooters to reward other sports at our expense. 

In my opinion, the NRA has been working against competititive shooting for nearly 20 years, trying to destroy shooting sports that do not generate gun sales for their advertizers.  Most 3 gun type shooting is gear queer oriented and requires the shooter to buy thousands of dollars a year in equipment to remain "cool".  Bullseye, smallbore and highpower rifle require skills and the firearms remain fairly constant in design.  So a competitor can buy gear and use it until it wears out and still have a great time. That flies in the face of gun sellers who want everyone spending thousands a year on new gear and filling their pockets. 

Whatever is going on with the NRA, they are not interested in being the leading organization in shooting anymore.  As we lose our rights to own semiautomatic firearms and self-defense you hear nothing from the NRA.  Wayne is too busy flying private jets to vacation and shop the world over at our expense.

This is how we lose our organization to a group of greedy idiots.........................................

https://nrawatch.org/report/the-continued-decline-of-the-nra/#:~:text=Ultimately%2C%20perhaps%20the%20greatest%20example,lost%20what%20was%20left%20of

An unlimited travel budget is a wonderful thing to have.

I can only afford to see the replica's, sigh.   

I have dropped my NRA membership years ago and the private gun club who demanded all members hold a NRA membership, who also has a board member on the NRA BOD...

CMP is doing a much better job at promoting the shooting sports.

"Firearms for Freedom"...now WLP is looting the museum to pay the millions in legal fees, under the guise of some 2A fight. What a travesty.

https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/rock-island-auction-company-selected-as-official-auction-house-of-nra-firearms-for-freedom-301479538.html

The CMP should make an offer for all of the NRA trophies.

tovaert wrote:"Firearms for Freedom"...now WLP is looting the museum to pay the millions in legal fees, under the guise of some 2A fight. What a travesty.

https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/rock-island-auction-company-selected-as-official-auction-house-of-nra-firearms-for-freedom-301479538.html

The CMP should make an offer for all of the NRA trophies.

This is a very old news.  For that matter referred article is almost year old.  NRA constantly receives donations of firearms from citizens, trusts, etc.  Only selected firearms retained.  Majority are auctioned, some go for prizes and sweepstakes. 

You can feel free to interpret NRA actions whichever way you would like.  As well as make your own decisions regarding saving $25 / year for being a member of the organization and donating more to its causes.  However the fact that NRA devotes a lot of funds to fight for 2A rights is unquestionable.  Alone with states associations and very few other 2A and gun rights organizations, NRA is fighting against Federal, States and local governments.  And number of anti-gun organization, who's propaganda quoted on this thread, supersedes by multiples 2A friendly organizations. 

With that said, do I want to see La Pierre go, and other changes instituted - YES!  However, I do not equate NRA to La Pierre!  Protecting 2A and our FREEDOMS, including freedom to own firearms, is more important to me!

AP

PhotoEscape wrote:
With that said, do I want to see La Pierre go, and other changes instituted - YES!  However, I do not equate NRA to La Pierre!  Protecting 2A and our FREEDOMS, including freedom to own firearms, is more important to me!

AP

NRA might get my membership back if you get your way.

The vitriol spouted by the lobbying arm — especially by WLP — has overshadowed the education and competition aspect. Maybe it’s a media thing that it appears that way but I can’t stand to listen to him.

On the other hand, if I’m honest, but for the lobbying and legal arm, there’d be nothing about which to educate and we’d all be playing competitive tiddlywinks.

“ However the fact that NRA devotes a lot of funds to fight for 2A rights is unquestionable.  Alone with states associations and very few other 2A and gun rights organizations, NRA is fighting against Federal, States and local governments. “


Funny, I haven’t seen the NRA’s name on the biggest cases in the last few years. But I have seen a state association ( NY ) and the GOA on several. 

Unfortunately for the membership of the NRA our future is going to be up to the courts; they found a weakness and an opening, so most of the money we gave will go for lawyers defend the few who misused our trust and funds.

lonegunman wrote:Wayne Lapierre and his top 12 cronies all take home million dollar plus salaries from the NRA, plus perks.  Thus we pay $20-30 million a year for NOTHING.  These thieves rob the membership blind and there is literally nothing we can do except stop funding these thieves.

I used to donate a firearm for a prize at Camp Perry, the deal was I'd do it for five years in memory of my Dad.  After the third year, the NRA demanded cash money.  They wanted cash and I could not stipulate who gets the award.  The idea being, I give them a $1000 dollars and they give away a single $50 dollar gift card to anyone they chose.  

My biggest complaint about the Nationals ws that they generate well over $500K a year and the NRA returns a few thousand dollars in prizes, shooters get little or no swag and are not treated very well by the NRA staff.  Crap like the Bianchi Cup generates less income and returns $50-100K in prizes.   I'm glad people are shooting anything, I just hate the idea that for years the NRA was milking the conventional pistol and rifle shooters to reward other sports at our expense. 

In my opinion, the NRA has been working against competititive shooting for nearly 20 years, trying to destroy shooting sports that do not generate gun sales for their advertizers.  Most 3 gun type shooting is gear queer oriented and requires the shooter to buy thousands of dollars a year in equipment to remain "cool".  Bullseye, smallbore and highpower rifle require skills and the firearms remain fairly constant in design.  So a competitor can buy gear and use it until it wears out and still have a great time. That flies in the face of gun sellers who want everyone spending thousands a year on new gear and filling their pockets. 

Whatever is going on with the NRA, they are not interested in being the leading organization in shooting anymore.  As we lose our rights to own semiautomatic firearms and self-defense you hear nothing from the NRA.  Wayne is too busy flying private jets to vacation and shop the world over at our expense.

Hmmm. The Bianchi Cup is such crap, the CMP wants a part of it.  Other 3 gun type shooting gear queer? We don't have high dollar, buying you way to skills mastery in BE or High Power? I don't think bashing another legitimate shooting sport helps anyone. 

John Bianchi and Ray Chapman in 1979 saw that the NRA was not the answer to trying to introduce something new to shooting sports, which actually the shotgun community already had. They sought to get industry to contribute/donate for support and prize money. It was successful. The NRA wanted a piece of the action and the Chapman Academy needed some range upgrades beyond their budget. I think in '83/84 it became the NRA Bianchi Cup. Yes, they had a very good prize table as well as a competitor bag for a number of years. Industry could donate and designate who was to receive how much for what. MidwayUSA was a major donor to the tune of over $100K more than one year.

I don't know exactly what happened, but I do know that NRA changed their policy regarding donations, similar to what you indicated or experienced. The NRA would dictate, what was to be prized and for what. I think this didn't set well with donors who were accustomed to the previous way. Attendance and donations started dropping off quickly.  

Last year CMP came to Bianchi and they even sponsored a social. In 2023 the Bianchi Cup and [at least some] Regional Action Pistol Championships will be under CMP Rules. I think CMP's involvement will be a good thing for Action Pistol. Jim Henderson is asking a lot of good questions to try to sort through the likes and dislikes. The AMU, Border Patrol and USMC Shooting Teams seem to be "all in" on that crap match called the Bianchi Cup.

40 years ago Bullseye Shooter's were Not the most friendly bunch, most of the guy's in their late 20's and early 30's went and found other people to shoot matches with.  That's why Bullseye has the recruitment problem today.

I was a match director for the NRA Hunter's Pistol back in the late 80's and early 90's; we definitely didn't get much backing from the NRA.  So that just disappeared after a while.

The run and gun guy's are definitely way more friendly and helpful if a person wants to get started.  Weather that's Cowboy action or USPSA, but the one thing young people today don't have is the time or money to play and practice like the old guy's of yesterday.  

So your going to see the ranks getting smaller and smaller.