Hi-Skor 700-X?

Saw some pistol powders (!THREE TYPES!) for the first time in maybe a month the other day, and in these days of buy what's THERE first and hope for the day when you can again choose your favorite, I went for the 700-X instead of the 800-X because I'm trying to keep my ability to assemble lighter loads for BE.

I guess the diameter of the charge holes on the Little Dandy powder rotors 5 through 8 are just too small for those big flakes???

Weights and even VOLUMES were all over the map. The drum is clean, nothing sticking in the hole, nothing to bridge or catch the powder as it falls, and running 3 or 4 charges into a .357 case (the #8 was uncomfortably close to overflowing at 4...) would be 3/16-inch below the case mouth on one series, even with the top for others, and mounded up in a nice 1/8-inch dome on a couple.

Weights were no better. One started at 3.5 grains then averaged 2.5 grains for one 10-charge series.

Will test the Star and Dillon slide type charge bars next. We'll see.

Tried to look up any H-S loads in the "old masters" thread but one of the links is dead.

Anyone know of good .38 and .45 loads using this stuff? Does it happen to be tolerant of charge weight/volume variations in the amounts used in BE loads?

Oh, by the way, I have maybe 6 ounces of ORIGINAL Hi-Skor, and that stuff is small granules that look like coarse flat gray-green sand. Also fluffy (was old in 8-oz cans the same size as 1-pounders). That stuff throws quite consistently from the smallest Lil' Dandy rotor I have.

From what I remember of 700-X from my trap shooting days it had some yellow flakes in it.  Just like how red dot has some red flakes.  Does it still have them?  I don't know the loads but I believe way back when 700-X was a very popular powder.  I don't know about pistol but in the shotgun weights between red dot and 700-X were either the same or very near the same for the same load.  I don't know the difference in burn rate between the 2 but I couldn't shoot 700-x because it would give me a headache.  Tried it several times and always the same result.

Scott

I am using 700x for the long line of my indoor matches right now to try it out. Using 4.4 grains under a Zero 185 JHP.  It does have some yellow flakes in it.  Tried it because that was what Travis Frerking tested it with.  It does not meter as well but the perceived recoil feels softer.  When it gets warmer out side I will shoot a few outdoor matches with Bullseye compare the scores and test them both from sandbags.  Out my last four slow fire matches with it my average has been 185 which is normal for me right now.

Yup, it has yellow dots all right. At first I thought someone at the plant had sneezed some plastic grinding debris or something into it.  Guess "Yellow Dot" is not only the wrong brand, but would sound too chicken for the shooting community???  Anyway, until reading your posts I was believing that IMR or whoever had decided to put taggants in it, for all the good that would do tracking terrorists and criminals who use either BP or genuine high explosives instead of propellants.

My Dad might have used this stuff waybackwhen--the size, shape and color of the flakes is very familiar, right down to what they look like when 4-8 of them stack up together and you get that shadow effect between them.

My belief right now is that the powder is bridging on the way INTO the charge hole in the rotors. The larger diameter rotor I have threw much more consistent charges, within the normal variations, and without the volume variations as well.

What kind of powder measures are you using with this stuff, and how do they perform?

Grumps
Some 20 yrs ago several of us experimented w/ 700 X and had good results. 4.2 to 4.4 grains and a 160 gr .45 was good for short & long lines. Loaded it on Stars, no bridging, excessive charge variation, or yellow flakes that I recall.


Sixftunda,
Check w/ Terry L. for 700 X info. When he was working out of his garage he had a very tight SF group posted on the wall using it. The bullet was either the 165 H&G hand cast or the 160 from Oak Harbor. Seems that a couple of Erie Co shooters used it. I don't know if they used it in their 5 shooters.


No info on the .38 although yrs ago Gil Hebard tested it in a 52 for "Gun Digest".

I traded the 700X for BE. I always returned after these  short infidelities.

Ron Habegger

38 Special -700X-3.6grs-Home cast 158 gr Lswc- Fired on a 50 yd target at 25 yds with 2" barreled S&W revolvers, 2 hand hold. 

Just loaded some old metal can 700X under 200gr. Lead SWC, 4.5 gr. Really shot well but smoky. A little more recoil than I thought. First time using this powder. Think I will drop back to 4.0gr. after I shoot up this batch of ammo.

700X is a very popular powder and is used by some of the major ammo makers in match ammo.  
The best barrel tester group I ever got was 4.8 gr. of 700X and the Zero Match 185 JHP..
15 shots...was going to try for 20  but chickened out..

WOW!

That group would be just fine at 25, but if it's at 50 it's outstanding!!! 15 shots no less.

When ya gonna test it again? That might be your "reference load" to make sure the gun hasn't shot loose.

Anyway, I think the biggest charge bar throws 3.88 (average of 10) of 700-X, and the accuracy testing with H&G 68s was under 3 inches, twice. I'm chicken too, but with a limit of 5 rounds per group.

Finally got velocities the other day with the old Hi-Skor (3.8 gr/752 fps did better/more consistently than 3.4 gr/701 fps) and the first shot cut the X-ring at 3 o'clock, then the next four went into a 1.85-inch group at 50, way up in the 6-ring.

Really didn't think my grip was any different...and for bench shooting I though my flinch was gone...or maybe it was just a bad bullet hitting that low. And the recoil did feel the same too, consistent with the velocity being good on that first shot. But I still am not weighing the cast bullets.

The Lil' Dandy measure might be more for 9mm/.40 in the Green Machine. Looks like if I change out the little steel sleeve under the casefeed tubes, I could even convert that to .38 Special.

Zero used 700x in its match ammo for a long time and still might, Jim Collins told me that himself.
The reason he said was it was accurate and cheap. Ive heard it doesn't meter as well as bullseye or others is the only drawback to me.

well I bought some 700x last night, any updates from guys using it for 45?

I've been using 3.4 gr 700X with both 185 and 200 LSWC bullets. Excellent accuracy and mild recoil. I've measured many charges from my Star reloader and they are spot on. So I personally haven't had any metering issues.
Jon

is that with frame mount?

No. Slide mounted 5" and 6" pistols. 5" is Ultra Dot II with Clark mount and 6" is custom mount on rear of slide with Aimpoint Micro. The 6" will reliably cycle 3.0 gr BE with 30mm Ultra Dot.
Jon

The Older Joe Chamber, all guard gunsmith from years ago, liked 700x with 185 lead bullet. 3.9 gr he used. Many great groups and he shot 2600 plus with it.

i love how 700x performs
i only wish i had more of it
for now im stuck with titegroup
as im not digging into my secret stash
even had a nice load for heavy 9mm

I'm now using 3.8 under a H&G 200-gr SWC.

Last chrono work was running a little over 700 fps, averaging about 710 or so.

Iron sights.

It even cycles a different .45 that has a guide rod and really stiff mainspring with a secondary spring that makes twisting the bushing off a booger. Frame mount on that one.

Reloading Unlimited in Ricevill TN had 700-X on sale the other day. Seems to be pretty readily available.

GrumpyOldMan wrote:I'm now using 3.8 under a H&G 200-gr SWC.
Last chrono work was running a little over 700 fps, averaging about 710 or so.

exactly the numbers i got

thats a real good load