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HV vs SV .22lr

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Post by ding-a-ling 11/5/2024, 8:42 pm

For matches, I exclusively use target grade .22lr. There is no doubt that the groups are tighter. For practice, I shoot a lot of Federal Auto Match. It seems to be a good balance between cost, reliability, and accuracy. The chronograph shows as much as 50fps between shots, but a 20-30 fps spread is more likely. 
I just bought a 100% new X-ESSE sport. Several sources, including the manual, suggest that SV ammo is what should always be used. Federal AM from a 4.5" barrel is around 1150fps. So, technically, it is HV, but just barely....

Would you consider Fed AM truly HV ammo?

Owners of the x-esse (and cousins), have you experienced problems with your pistol(s) when using a mild HV ammo?

TIA
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Post by STEVE SAMELAK 11/5/2024, 10:25 pm

If you practice with markedly poorer ammo than you compete with, how do you determine what error is you and which is ammo?
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Post by ding-a-ling 11/6/2024, 4:51 am

STEVE SAMELAK wrote:If you practice with markedly poorer ammo than you compete with, how do you determine what error is you and which is ammo?
Groups are groups. Deviation from the expected value is still a reflection of ability regardless of precision achieved. In other words, I can still tell if I shot a good group because I track group size.

There is also the $ to consider... Eley is quite proud of their product.
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Post by DA/SA 11/6/2024, 4:52 am

If you are to learn to call your shots, it's important to have relatively accurate ammo to train with.
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Post by ding-a-ling 11/6/2024, 5:26 am

DA/SA wrote:If you are to learn to call your shots, it's important to have relatively accurate ammo to train with.
FedAM is accurate enough to call shots.... 


It's not like I'm at the range with a slingshot and pond skipping stones....
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Post by BE Mike 11/6/2024, 7:12 am

ding-a-ling wrote:
DA/SA wrote:If you are to learn to call your shots, it's important to have relatively accurate ammo to train with.
FedAM is accurate enough to call shots.... 


It's not like I'm at the range with a slingshot and pond skipping stones....
If Federal Auto Match will consistently hold the ten ring at 50 yards, it is good enough. The question is, does it?
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Post by ding-a-ling 11/6/2024, 7:20 am


If Federal Auto Match will consistently hold the ten ring at 50 yards, it is good enough. The question is, does it?
A topic for another time....

How about velocity and the effect on the x-esse?
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Post by BE Mike 11/6/2024, 7:42 am

ding-a-ling wrote:

If Federal Auto Match will consistently hold the ten ring at 50 yards, it is good enough. The question is, does it?
A topic for another time....

How about velocity and the effect on the x-esse?
I have been using that ammo for quite awhile. Having said that, I am long retired from bullseye pistol competition. I do regularly shoot once a week and shoot it in a Sig P322 and S&W model 18-3 revolver. It doesn't seem to be overly powerful, but the empties do eject pretty forcefully out of my pistol. When I take my bullseye pistols out for a shooting session, I use CCI Standard Velocity or SK Standard because of the accuracy, reliability and lower velocity. Pistols are just mini-machines. Just like cars, if you are hard on them, they won't go as long without something breaking. Is it worth it to save the money on cheaper ammo? The decision is yours. Whether you like hearing it or not, accuracy of practice, as well as, match ammo, should also be a consideration. If you are at the stage in your shooting where you shoot a lot of wide shots (5's and 6's) that you call, then ammo accuracy isn't that much of a factor.
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Post by JRV 11/6/2024, 7:51 am

Just shoot subsonic ammo. The gun isn’t designed around or sprung for supersonic ammo. FedAM is supersonic ammo. You’re not shooting a Ruger. The X-esse guns are not Pardinis, but they’re also not cheap.

How much are you shooting?

I go through a brick of .22 each month. Not a lot, but regular shooting (50-100 round practice sessions, one of which might be an indoor 900, plus an outdoor match). I stopped buying CCI SV because I was only saving $25-30 per month versus Eley Club and Eley Target. That’s an easy sum to save elsewhere in the grand scheme of things.

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Post by Russ OR 11/6/2024, 10:05 am

If it was my new X-esse, I'd avoid anything but SV ammo; on accounta that slide stop on the drop down trigger guard being prone to breaking. - I think? 2¢.

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Post by Toni_in_Sweden 11/6/2024, 11:24 am

ding_a_ling don´t use Federal Auto Match in X-ESSE sport. 4.5" barrel with 1150fps this is too much, in this barrel it would be about 900fps for SV. But it is your gun but not so long. I have been gunsmith for over 20 years.
Greetings from Sweden
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Post by Wobbley 11/6/2024, 12:29 pm

Here are my results of 22 velocities fired from a pistol.  This includes Auto Match.  While that had a velocity of 1050 fps that only means a 5%-10%  increase in blowback momentum.  As an engineer, I find it VERY HARD to conclude that increase would damage a gun that was properly designed.HV vs SV .22lr Img_0516
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Post by ding-a-ling 11/6/2024, 12:34 pm

Wobbley wrote:Here are my results of 22 velocities fired from a pistol.  This includes Auto Match.  While that had a velocity of 1050 fps that only means a 5%-10%  increase in blowback momentum.  As an engineer, I find it VERY HARD to conclude that increase would damage a gun that was properly designed.
Thanks!

Honestly, 50/50 across the interweb yea vs nay on the mild HV. Thanks for the statistics.
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Post by DA/SA 11/6/2024, 1:15 pm

I googled the manual:

All xesse pistols are .22 cal standard or high velocity weapons...
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Post by ding-a-ling 11/6/2024, 1:19 pm

DA/SA wrote:I googled the manual:

All xesse pistols are .22 cal standard or high velocity weapons...
There is some inconsistency among the manuals. I have consulted 4 or five from various models and years and the results are not concurrent.

The manyal for the pistol I just bought new says SV.

I guess it is like any other machine.... ymmv.
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Post by DA/SA 11/6/2024, 1:37 pm

I only looked in one manual, but if the manual for yours states SV, that's what I would use.

There seem to be lots of Norma TAC 22 users that are happy with it, and the last I bought was about six cents a round after shipping, if you are wanting inexpensive SV that shoots well. Also a couple more on Wobbly's list such as the Magtech SV.

I don't have an Xesse, but I use CCI SV and Aguila SV for training ammo, both reasonably priced per round if bought in bulk.
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Post by Centerline 11/6/2024, 4:05 pm

I don't have an xesse but I used fed AM in my victory. It was plenty accurate enough. The problem was that it would bounce off the nylon slide stop too fast and cause FTFs. I decided to keep the HV ammo for pistols with heavier slides.

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Post by ding-a-ling 11/6/2024, 4:20 pm

Centerline wrote:I don't have an xesse but I used fed AM in my victory. It was plenty accurate enough. The problem was that it would bounce off the nylon slide stop too fast and cause FTFs. I decided to keep the HV ammo for pistols with heavier slides.
My now back-up .22 is an old S&W 22A. It is plenty accurate, just not very ergonomic.... I bet that I have run 20k rounds of Federal Auto Match through it without incident. I've had to replace the buffer a couple times, but I think they were designed to last about 5k rounds no matter what ammo is used. It would jam once in about every 300 rounds. That was my indication to give it a quick scrub. 

I'm sure the 22A slide and the Victory slide are very similar in weight.
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