reloading dies for BE

I have been reading about pistol reloading to decide on my first set of pistol dies (9mm). The features are all over the map. Super cheap Lee dies to Super expensive Redding "Competition Pro Series" die set. What is the best die set for our sport (BE). I am not looking for cheap, I am looking for what does the best job of functionally meeting our needs.

-T

I like Dillon dies. They're high quality and come apart easily for cleaning which is a plus for progressive press use especially with waxed lead bullets.

And Lee’s work fine

I will eventually be using a progressive press. The Lee set has a flairing die that is hollow to allow powder to be dumped through the die also. Is it a standard for all brands of dies to have the expander allow a powder dispenser to mount on top and let powder pass through?
-TH

Generally yes

I vote no.

WesG wrote:I vote no.

 Your excused.

Honestly, I don't think there's any bad dies out there. Just about any will work.  I prefer Lee, originally because of price.  I found that in spite of the price, Lee dies have some unique features and precision that others don't.  One critical area is your crimp.  This should be done as a separate step.  Don't use the bullet seating die for crimping.  Use the Lee Factory Crimp Die which is adjustable and gives you precise control of how much crimp to put on.  It really does a great job.

Lee dies are indeed great value for money and many folks advocate both their sizing dies and their "factory crimp and size" and "taper crimp" dies. It is also very easy and economical to order custom Lee dies to your specification.

BUT

If you eventually gravitate to a Dillon progressive press, Lee dies are not ideal. The tool heads are much thicker than on most other presses and the Lee dies are typically not long enough to allow you to fit the locking rings above the tool head. OK, the rings can be fitted underneath, but that makes things awkward and (on my XL650 at least) on stations 1, 3 and 5 the rings foul the underside of the frame and it is very difficult to tighten the rings firmly without pulling the tool head out from the frame.

I agree with above poster - if you get a Dillon press the Dillon dies are generally best (having said that I've bought other dies for specific features - like the ability to fit a micrometer bullet seater, etc.)

Just my 2c.

The LNL comes with a charging die. You can get an expander insert for it from Hornady, or Photoescape. Otherwise it just makes contact with the case mouth to activate the measure.

That brings up the question of whether to buy a set of dies, or just the pieces you need, size/decap, seat, crimp. You're going to need to buy a separate crimp die anyway.

WesG makes a very good point. If you know that you will be loading 45ACP for Bullseye primarily (and especially if you already know which press you will eventually settle on) then you will be short-cutting a lot of grief if you buy specific individual dies that are proven (there are many threads on this forum which can guide you).

On the other hand - the standard Lee 4 die carbide set at about $40+ is a darn good start and can easily be sold on later if you aspire to other dies.
https://www.amazon.com/LEE-PRECISION-90963-Carbide-4-Die/dp/B00162TEWG/ref=sr_1_4?dchild=1&keywords=Lee+pistol+dies&qid=1583775411&sr=8-4

Each individual specialist die will cost more than the Lee set - sometimes a LOT more!

I'm just an average reloader/shooter, but have a bit of OCD and like to make my handloads as good as I can. I got my first Lee dies in '71 and have used Lee dies since, along with some RCBS, Pacific, Hornady, and Redding. The only "problem" I have ever had with a Lee die is on a 45 ACP powder through/expander die the expander portion is a bit too short for my cast lead bullets. Not enough flare. I have used my Lee dies to produce some very accurate (for me) ammo for my 308 bolt gun and my Dam Wesson 44 H (2" @ 50'). More than anything it's the nut behind the press handle that is the difference between good ammo and sloppy reloads. A conscious reloader can make good ammo on the least expensive equipment and a sloppy, hurried reloader couldn't make good ammo on the most expensive, high tech tools...

Looking at a Redding catalog, if you want to go that way...

I'd be going for the Competition Pro Series set. Carbide size/decap, micrometer seater with the spring loaded floating stem, and a crimp die.

They have a 'Premium' set with a micrometer seater, but it's not a floating stem. BTW, the special expander is nothing but nicely polished and TiN coated. Turns out my older Redding dies have stepped expanders (Lyman M type) as well.

Expand at the charging station. I'd probably look at Photoescape's single stage press setup, with the adapter pieces for the LNL measure. Get the micrometer insert for the measure, BTW.

The PE setup does away with (I think) the odd linkage Hornady uses to 'bottom out' the expander to force it in the case during charging.

WesG wrote:The LNL comes with a charging die. You can get an expander insert for it from Hornady, or Photoescape. Otherwise it just makes contact with the case mouth to activate the measure.

That brings up the question of whether to buy a set of dies, or just the pieces you need, size/decap, seat, crimp. You're going to need to buy a separate crimp die anyway.

Why do you have to buy a separate crimp die? A Dillon set comes with a sizing die, seating die and crimp. No wasted dies and none left to buy if your press has a powder through expander.

Good point re Dillon. Most other makers standard die sets come with a combo seat/crimp. Never had much trouble with that for 40+ years, until I got (maybe too) picky loading for a 1911. Then again, most of the cast bullets I Ioaded in 357 and 44 mag had crimp grooves in them. Not common it seems with typical SWC's for 45.

The heavy crimp recommended by some make for some ugly rds done in a standard die.

my .02... even moderately expensive dies aren’t close to the expensive part of shooting sports. and, you will have them for life if you take care of them. i decided i don’t like carbide sizing dies anymore—all the ones i’ve tried tend to overwork the brass and leave girdled looking rounds. and spraying some lube in a ziplock and shaking isn’t that much work. for full length sizing dies you can find good, old ones on ebay for cheap! for new, i really like mighty armory. photoescape makes great expander/ptu’s; and i really, really like redding comp seating dies. redding profile crimp dies for wheelguns and taper crimp for auto.

Honestly, I'm leaning back in the direction of good old steel dies myself.

Interesting thing, check out the Redding catalog about why they developed the dual ring carbide sizer.

My opinion; a lot of reloaders, especially newer reloaders are gullible when it comes to reloading tools. Manufacturer hype is responsible for a lot and forum "experts" contribute to "not really a necessary improvement" in reloading tools/equipment/components. Some newer reloaders will see a "good" review (opinion) in a forum and take it as gospel and buy that extra and often unnecessary tool. I don't shoot competition but I do like my handloads to be as well assembled and as accurate as possible, but without buying into every "new and improved" product I see. My dies and press will often give me less than .002" variation in bullet seating depth (my plain Lee seating dies, not FCD, not micro-adjustable), and the 308 handloads I checked (LC brass with Hornady bullets) have a consistent .001"-.002" concentricity. These are loaded with my Lee dies. Not condemning, just pointing out a phenomenon. But I gotta admit, I'm a tool nut and often buy tools, just because... 

I use the Redding competition dies for .45ACP and 9mm.

Generally, I don't like lock rings that have set screws that put pressure on the threads. I like the ones that tighten upon themselves. Otherwise, not a big difference. I've been happy with Hornady for pistol and I use Forster for rifle.

Joel

The Hornady Sure Loc rings are the best, its a split ring setup with a set screw to tighten but doesn't affect the threads.

+1 on the above Hornady rings

I reload on a Lee LoadMaster progressive press that I bought used.  It makes good ammo with the Lee dies.  But after a while, I noticed that the bullets weren't always seated as straight as I'd like.  I think that's REALLY because the press is old and heavily used and isn't perfectly lined up any more, but I solved it with better dies.  In my efforts to seat the bullets straighter, I switched to a Lyman 'M' die to do the flaring, because it does a 2-step flare.  I think it's a real improvement, because it allows me to be more consistent in how I place the bullet atop the case (which I do by hand).  You want to loctite the flaring part where it screws into the die body, though... it's very annoying when that works loose.  I also switched to a Redding Competition seating die that has an internal spring that applies constant downward pressure to the seating stem.  That helped significantly with seating the bullets straighter in the cases, so it too, is a real improvement.  It also has the micrometer adjustment, which is nice, but not critical.  I also purchased a new Lee 45 sizing die, but it sized the cases to a different dimension than my old Lee 45 sizing die, so I sent it back to Lee.  Otherwise, I've not had any issues with the Lee 45 sizing, powder-through, or factory crimp dies, and the Lee Autodisk powder measure works great for me.  As others have mentioned, that's probably true for most manufacturer's dies, too.  I'm still making ammo that shoots to call.  

As for lock rings... I've found that the Lee rings with the rubber O-ring work just fine; I've used several of them for 10's of thousands of rounds, and never had one come loose.  But I've also tried the Hornady rings, and they do seem like a more "sure" design, as long as you can get a wrench onto the lock screw.  The Lyman lock ring that came with the 'M' die has never come loose, but tightening the set screw does visibly mar the die threads.  The Redding lock ring that came with the seating die, on the other hand, has come loose on me.  Maybe I just got a bad one, but the one I got is complete junk, because the set screw won't stay tight.  I bought the Hornady lock ring to replace the Redding one.

Dave

If you are loading lead bullets, the Dillon dies are the easiest to clean.  You don't have to take the whole die off the press/tool head.

Thanks for everyone's feedback. I have decided to go with the following:

Hornady AP progressive press
Dillon Seating die (complete sets are sold out everywhere)
Bullet shoulder Seat Stem for SWC from UniqueTek
Photo Escape drop through expander

I still need size die and crimp die. I would like to get the Lee dies. However, I notice that Redding offers a micrometer adjustable crimping die (over $100 for just the crimping die). Is this necessary for fine tuning/ adjusting the crimp?

Similarly, redding also offers a micrometer adjustable neck bushing die for rifles which is completely unnecessary and adjusting the location of a neck bushing by .001" is worthless. I am wondering if this is a similar situation with the crimp adjustment. Comments?