reloading dies for BE

by hengehold Sun Mar 08, 2020 1:28 pm

First topic message reminder :

I have been reading about pistol reloading to decide on my first set of pistol dies (9mm). The features are all over the map. Super cheap Lee dies to Super expensive Redding "Competition Pro Series" die set. What is the best die set for our sport (BE). I am not looking for cheap, I am looking for what does the best job of functionally meeting our needs.

-T

by Texasref Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:34 am

Lots of really good info. here.
I would offer this for consideration: Once everything is adjusted and set, lock the die down. No need to mess with them.
To that I would not consider the Redding micro adjustable with the mag wheels, turbo and
posi-traction rear end.
I do recomend the Lee FCD, especially for SWC in 45ACP. Makes cycling the slide more better.

Good luck.

by rich.tullo Sat Feb 27, 2021 10:28 am

Redding is nice, Hornady is good too , Lee a close second.

by Allgoodhits Sat Feb 27, 2021 1:10 pm

To best give advice, you leave us with assuming or guessing too much.

The convenience and benefit of the micro adjustable seater and crimping dies are most beneficial if your are using using multiple brands of brass, and multiple brands, shape, and weight bullets. With good notes, previously determined good settings are easily repeatable. The Redding Comp Dies are great for that.

However, if you plan to load the same brand brass, bullet weight and shape it doesn't matter as much. Set it, and forget it.

Last, some of your research may be a mute point. It is my understanding the availability of many dies or die sets are taking the path of primers, bullets and powder. You may have to settle on that which you can get. I would suggest carbide dies, beyond that, just make sure your seating die and your crimp die are separate operations.

Go 4 it!

by hengehold Sat Feb 27, 2021 3:27 pm

Allgoodhits wrote:To best give advice, you leave us with assuming or guessing too much.

The convenience and benefit of the micro adjustable seater and crimping dies are most beneficial if your are using using multiple brands of brass, and multiple brands, shape, and weight bullets. With good notes, previously determined good settings are easily repeatable. The Redding Comp Dies are great for that.

However, if you plan to load the same brand brass, bullet weight and shape it doesn't matter as much. Set it, and forget it.

Last, some of your research may be a mute point. It is my understanding the availability of many dies or die sets are taking the path of primers, bullets and powder. You may have to settle on that which you can get. I would suggest carbide dies, beyond that, just make sure your seating die and your crimp die are separate operations.

Go 4 it!

Thanks. And yes you are correct. I tried ordering die sets the other day and they were sold out everywhere I looked except for EBay where I could pay twice the price and get it now. I have another 6 months until my first center fire gun is complete and ready to shoot so I can just wait it out for now.

It is kind of weird though how reloading dies are sold out. What are all of those people going to do without primers? :-)

by WesG Sat Feb 27, 2021 4:14 pm

They maybe haven't thought that far ahead yet.

by noylj Sat Feb 27, 2021 6:49 pm

My 1050s have a lot of Lee dies in tool head, and almost no Dillon dies.
Micrometers don't make more accurate loads, they just look cool and let you return close to previous setting.
Sizing dies: many feed issues are caused by not sizing down the case far enough. Dillon dies have way too much opening. Lee and Hornady size down the furthest. The titanium nitride coating Hornady uses and the Redding titanium carbide ring make sizing a slightly easier.
Expander: the die is unimportant, it is the size of the expander plug that matters. The ID should be expanded to be 0.001-0.002" under actual bullet diameter. This will produce all the bullet tension possible and improves seating over smaller IDs. This is not case mouth flare. Some people find Lymon M-dies to be wonderful. Mine don't do what was promised. I prefer the unibodt xpanders like Hornady.
Power-through expander: you buy the ones made for your powder measure. For working up loads where powder is poured in the case by hand, I prefer Lee pte with a Lee powder funnel.
Seating die: only the seating stem really matters and a proper custom one is much better than a generic. With age, I have lost a lot of fine muscle control and prefer to manually use a Lee bullet feeder with a Lee seating die. Lee also makes very good custom seating stems inexpensively. The Hornady seating stem comes the a sleeve to help bullet alignment. Remember it is the seating stem fit and degree of coax with the press and not the name on the die.
Crimp: All taper crimp dies are equally good, so if I need to buy one, I buy Lee (and NOT the fcd). Better for accuracy to ensure bullet is seated square and doesn't bulge the case than to "iron out the problem."
The only roll crimp dies I buy are Redding Profile Crimp dies--they give best accuracy of all I've tested in 38 Spl, 357 Mag, and 44 Mag. The Lee fcd, with carbide ring removed, is the second best roll crimp die.
Minimum sizing will improve accuracy, but you can find variations in wall thickness that prevent using an over-sized sizing die. In my M52s, I use unsized cases and in 38 revolvers, I use a Lee FCD with crimp guts removed for sizing when loading light wadcutter loads.
Myth of Lee lock rings: the old Lee lock nuts can not always tighten dies on thick tool heads. This is due to o-ring only permitting threads at top of nut. So, what we do is remove the lock nut, remove the o-ring, flip the lock nut so the o-ring groove is up and screw all the way back up the die. You will get at least 2 full turns, whereas the thin Dillon lock nuts only have 1-2 thread turns. To hold a die in place, you only need about 1/4-1/2 turn. All it does is hold the die in place.

by CR10X Sun Feb 28, 2021 8:06 am

After 2 pages, I'll put in my 2 cents.

The simplest route for me (to help me get better at bullseye) was to get a 650 with a case feeder, Dillon dies and lube the cases anyway. (I started with a Square Deal and it produced excellent bullseye loads and it still does all the other pistol reloading I need, except for the three 650's set up for .45, 9mm and .38 Spl. But the 650 saves time and they ain't making any more of that for me.) Get the biggest case cleaner / tumbler you can, buy quality bullets that are cheap enough for you to shoot a lot and get large lots of the same type of brass. Find a load that works for your gun and load in lots of 500 or 1,000 or more for consistency. Don't chase loads and spend the extra time dryfiring and training. (Yes, there are things you can do to help the consistency of the 650 a little more, but really, just get stared and get the basics down so you can get back to training and shooting (more) with less time on the press.)

CR

by rich.tullo Wed Mar 10, 2021 4:39 pm

hengehold wrote:I have been reading about pistol reloading to decide on my first set of pistol dies (9mm). The features are all over the map. Super cheap Lee dies to Super expensive Redding "Competition Pro Series" die set. What is the best die set for our sport (BE). I am not looking for cheap, I am looking for what does the best job of functionally meeting our needs.

-T

Match ammo 9mm buy a case of Atlanta Arms if you can , buy the lees for practice and just load good functional practice ammo using Hornady XTP same a AA and VV340 same as AA. Making Bullseye accurate 9mm is a challenge. AA ammo will hold an inch at 50 yards in a well built 1911.

by 5shooter Sat Mar 13, 2021 8:46 am

To the OP ... VV powder is a great choice with the Hornady LNL AP press you mentioned. The Hornady powder drop with the micrometer adjustment can be very accurate and consistent, even with super light loads from <1.0 - 1.5 gr., but it is picky about powders. It hates flattened ball powders like Clays and TG and will hang up with them, but it loves VV.

by Schaumannk Sat Mar 13, 2021 5:56 pm

“Making Bullseye accurate 9mm is a challenge. AA ammo will hold an inch at 50 yards in a well built 1911.”

I don’t find it to be all that challenging. A 9mm with a KKM slow twist rate barrel is an inherently accurate gun. All factory ammo seems to shoot fine, even Winchester White Box. My reloads shoot just as well. My triggering is a much bigger issue. :-)

by hengehold Sat Mar 13, 2021 9:28 pm

5shooter wrote:To the OP ... VV powder is a great choice with the Hornady LNL AP press you mentioned. The Hornady powder drop with the micrometer adjustment can be very accurate and consistent, even with super light loads from <1.0 - 1.5 gr., but it is picky about powders. It hates flattened ball powders like Clays and TG and will hang up with them, but it loves VV.

I was looking at the Dillon powder measure and it looks like an inferior design compared to the rotating drum design found with Hornady, RCBS, etc.

by Schaumannk Sat Mar 13, 2021 9:50 pm

hengehold wrote:
5shooter wrote:To the OP ... VV powder is a great choice with the Hornady LNL AP press you mentioned. The Hornady powder drop with the micrometer adjustment can be very accurate and consistent, even with super light loads from <1.0 - 1.5 gr., but it is picky about powders. It hates flattened ball powders like Clays and TG and will hang up with them, but it loves VV.

I was looking at the Dillon powder measure and it looks like an inferior design compared to the rotating drum design found with Hornady, RCBS, etc.

A lot of things aren’t optimum about the Dillon reloaders. However, their customer service and warranty is very good.
The Powder measure, powder bar, and powder through dies do their job. You will find through experience that not all powders meter well, no matter which equipment you are using.
I’ve had my go rounds with Clays and ultimately quit using it because of the metering problems and the temperature sensitivity.
If you are doing set and forget with only one round, and one charge, there are a lot of systems better than Dillon, but if you experiment or change powders, powder weights, and bullets frequently, the Dillon is the quickest to adjust and dial in (from what I have heard)

by **Wobbley** Sun Mar 14, 2021 4:28 pm

Schaumannk wrote:
hengehold wrote:
5shooter wrote:To the OP ... VV powder is a great choice with the Hornady LNL AP press you mentioned. The Hornady powder drop with the micrometer adjustment can be very accurate and consistent, even with super light loads from <1.0 - 1.5 gr., but it is picky about powders. It hates flattened ball powders like Clays and TG and will hang up with them, but it loves VV.

I was looking at the Dillon powder measure and it looks like an inferior design compared to the rotating drum design found with Hornady, RCBS, etc.
A lot of things aren’t optimum about the Dillon reloaders. However, their customer service and warranty is very good.

Top level customer service can only makeup for poorly designed product in a limited fashion.
The Powder measure, powder bar, and powder through dies do their job. You will find through experience that not all powders meter well, no matter which equipment you are using.

Ive found better results metering more and different types of powders through rotating drum measures than the slide measures.
I’ve had my go rounds with Clays and ultimately quit using it because of the metering problems and the temperature sensitivity.
If you are doing set and forget with only one round, and one charge, there are a lot of systems better than Dillon, but if you experiment or change powders, powder weights, and bullets frequently, the Dillon is the quickest to adjust and dial in (from what I have heard).

The Hornady or RCBS have micrometer spindles available which are far more repeatable and predictable than the Dillon.

And I’m not saying this to BASH Dillon. But the powder measuring system needs a redesign for multiple reasons (leaks, excessive variance with certain powders, poor adjustability of and poor expanders). Can all these be fixed? Yes, but not with the system as designed.

by Schaumannk Sun Mar 14, 2021 5:02 pm

It is quite possibly to put the Hornady powder drop onto a Dillon press. I have friends who have done it.

But, as someone whose primary interest is shooting, and not screwing with my reloading equipment, there comes a time to just stop tinkering, declare your loads good enough, and do some real world testing and practice.

My favorite high master shoots CCI SV exclusively in his Mavel conversions, and 3.7 of Clays under a 200g cast bullet for centerfire and .45, reloaded on a standard Dillon 550 for years, until he won a 650 in a raffle a couple of years ago. It doesn’t seem to be holding him back any.

by Guest Mon Mar 15, 2021 7:18 am

All of this discussion and no comment on the virtues of the bullet proof press. It covers everything you need. Find a Star tool and your concerns are over.

by Jack H Tue Mar 16, 2021 1:57 am

Guest wrote:All of this discussion and no comment on the virtues of the bullet proof press. It covers everything you need. Find a Star tool and your concerns are over.

Can't load 223 and 270 on a Star. But the 550 Dillon is very good at that.

I have two 550 presses. One for large primers One for small primers.
Then switching the die head and shell holders is dirt simple.

I also have a LnL progressive I have never used. I do like it's Hornady powder measure.
For individual weighed rifle charging, I use a Redding measure by itself.

I tried and still have some micrometer top seaters. I do not see a major advantage in them.

by Star loader Thu Apr 08, 2021 7:23 am

You will never go wrong with Star dies but they are in The Star Universal tool.

by Star loader Thu Apr 08, 2021 7:25 am

You can load 223 on a Star . I have a Super Star in 223.

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