Rock Island 1911...NOT Rock River

JRV wrote:I have a Rock Island that I built into a ballgun, starting with a base model .45.  



After nearly tripling the cost of the gun to replace every component that was not slide, frame, or barrel, it is reliable and shoots on call.  I have never RRed it, but I have tested it off bags at 25 yards during ladder testing.  



After all that effort, it’s not worth it at all—save and except a fun project/curiosity.  Get a used 9mm RO or Loaded Target as a base gun for bullseye use.  For general competition and range use, sure, it’s a fine base gun.  At a minimum, replace every part in the fire control group with tool steel parts from a good maker.  Fit and test slowly.

I would not expect a barrel from any manufacture to drop in.  You might get lucky, but the odds are not in your favor.  

RoyDean wrote:So. Disclaimer first. I have never owned or contemplated owning, a Rock Island Armory 1911. But numerous commentators, I mean almost every time the RIA brand gets a mention on this forum, opinion is very poor. MIM (i.e. cheap and nasty) internal components. poor assembly and fit. But, on the positive side, they are very inexpensive.

I guess that it comes down to what level you are currently at, what are your objectives and are you actually training for competition, or just plinking?

From a big picture perspective. If you don't already own a decent 22 that can hold the 8 ring at 25 yards off a rest, then you are wasting good ammo and time with a 45 or whatever!

As for 9mm vs 38 Super vs whatever. It is all just an academic exercise if you can't keep ten rounds of 45 in the black at 25 yards - one handed, two handed or off a rest first!

Learn to shoot a 22. Then make or find some decent "soft" 45 target ammo and learn to shoot whatever 45 gun you have at 25 yards as best you can.

Only once you have done that is there any point messing with all of the other stuff.

Oh, and if you are over 60 or otherwise have any vision issues - use guns with red dots, at least to start with.

sbtzc wrote:Rock Island 9mm - been there, done that. It would not stay on a repair center at 25 yards. Sent it back to Rock Island complaining about poor accuracy. They sent it back with a test target and said it was within specifications. The test target had a five inch group and was marked 7 yards.

Cheap doesn't cut it.

RoyDean wrote:Dear Boisepaw,

Sorry, I "preached to the converted" without knowing your background. My bad!

As for inexpensive 1911's that might have potential, take look at TISAS, made in Turkey. I do not yet have a definitive conclusion, but looking quite interesting.

RoyDean wrote:Dear Boisepaw,

Sorry, I "preached to the converted" without knowing your background. My bad!

As for inexpensive 1911's that might have potential, take look at TISAS, made in Turkey. I do not yet have a definitive conclusion, but looking quite interesting.

boisepaw wrote:
Thanks for your response.  But I'm a little unclear as to whether you are pleased with the outcome of the work that was done on the RIA 1911 or disappointed.  When I look at the target...seeing at least 5 shots and perhaps a total of 10 in one nice ragged hole, that looks pretty good.

JRV wrote:

boisepaw wrote:
Thanks for your response.  But I'm a little unclear as to whether you are pleased with the outcome of the work that was done on the RIA 1911 or disappointed.  When I look at the target...seeing at least 5 shots and perhaps a total of 10 in one nice ragged hole, that looks pretty good.

I’m pleased with the outcome but only to the extent that I acknowledge it was a combination of disproportionate effort/cost and some dumb luck.  

The gun—presumably the barrel—is load sensitive.  It will not group with any loads using Bullseye or W231 powder.  It only groups with one load using Clays powder.  I spent more time, money, and effort making this gun shoot acceptably (the 4:30 flyers are consistent—not super far out, but nevertheless there every couple mags) than I did with my primary match pistol.  My SARO with an EGW bushing will perform with this gun using more loads, and cost less to do so.

spursnguns wrote:M1911's are like sportscars....

1.  Don't buy cheap ones for they are cheap for a reason.
2.  Own one and you better know how to use your tools.

Jim

boisepaw wrote:So a couple more questions if you don't mind...

Do I understand that you are still shooting the factory barrel rather than getting a match barrel?  And that is giving you some nice groups with those cursed flyers?

Did you spend much time fitting that barrel or on slide to frame fit?  Did you change the whole firing system...springs, trigger etc. (Sorry but I can't write AND see all that you had written earlier.)

What would you say was the most important modification that  you made?

You talked about an EGW bushing on your SARO.  What did you do on the bushing on the RIA and did that have any positive accuracy effect?  Seems like that would be a great place...not terribly expensive...to start.  Might a good bushing be a big help to the accuracy?

My very best bullseye pistols have bushings that I simply cannot turn far enough to get the spring out.  One of them...at a gunsmith a couple of weeks ago...frustrated the smith so badly that after 20 minutes he gave up and just put together all the slide parts before reassembling the gun.  He couldn't move the bushing far enough.  

So I've thought about going to all full length or two piece guide rods.  Maybe helpful?

Then on to the ammo...I'm still shooting some of the handloads that Jerry made up for me 15 years ago before life changed so much.  But I just got a used Dillon 550 specifically to start reloading for the 38 Super.  I've shot some factory flat ended bullets from the 38 Super that shot great!

But I thought, the one and only time that I went to Camp Perry over 20 years ago, that most of the top competitors were shooting hollow point bullets?  But it doesn't seem like I'm seeing that now?

I don't know that I EVER want to get into reloading 9mm.  And I have probably 2000 rounds of 45 ACP reloads to still shoot through.  But I'm all ears about any thoughts about types of bullets and particular manufacturers and models of bullets.

Bummer about the powder.  I have 7 pounds of Bullseye I've been carrying around for 20 years thinking that any day I was going to become a Dillon master and start loading my own handgun rounds.

Anything more on the subject that anyone would want to share would be welcome...guns, parts, fitting work, ammo...I'm all ears.

rich.tullo wrote:
Today, I would get a TISAS before a Rock Island because the frame is forged and they seem pretty tight.