Times getting short, I want to get a P100 tab before I retire.
+10
1911a145
jareds06
james r chapman
sharkdoctor
xdarrows
bruce martindale
straybrit
john bickar
Wobbley
Docmedic
14 posters
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Times getting short, I want to get a P100 tab before I retire.
First topic message reminder :
I'm about to hit 22 years in the Army and before I get booted out (probably another 8 years) I would like to earn my Presidents 100 tab. Now a bit a background I'm a GM in USPSA and multi-gun Master in IDPA. Making GM damn near took me 10 years with no formal training and just enough practice to start winning matches.
Outside of the 6 Combat EIC points I have from shooting M17's I don't have any real experience in Service Pistol Matches at Camp Perry and hell I never been there either, I always thought Bullseye was for the old guys... Well it turns out I became old not to long ago.
I'm trying to develop a structured Dryfire & Livefire practice program but I'm struggling on what to work on. I can keep them in the black at 25 "most" of the time but its not like I'm break 85's on Rapids and Timed. The onehanded shooting this still pretty new to me, hard to rip my offhand off that pistol.
One of my issues is I don't know if I really have the correct shooting form either. Seen all the youtube vids of Zins and AMU talk about it and pretty much built my stance from that. 'vertical with shooting lane, offhand in pocket body relaxed but shooting arm stiff, gun pointing to target with a stiff handshake grip' I would say my hold is pretty tight but there are times when I brake a shot, called it good but actually tossed in the white somewhere, its never consistent but it "feels" consistent is the best way I can put it.
I'm going to see if the ARMU can take me out for the week at Perry in July just so I can experience the full match. But prior to that I want to make sure I do every damn thing prior, but this is where I need help to understand what and how I should practice.
Current gear (using for bullseye)
Sig P210, that will need some work on the trigger.
S&W 41
STI 2011 Edge in .45 that shoots lights out. (needs trigger work to bring up the weight.)
What do you all suggest that I can work on?
I'm about to hit 22 years in the Army and before I get booted out (probably another 8 years) I would like to earn my Presidents 100 tab. Now a bit a background I'm a GM in USPSA and multi-gun Master in IDPA. Making GM damn near took me 10 years with no formal training and just enough practice to start winning matches.
Outside of the 6 Combat EIC points I have from shooting M17's I don't have any real experience in Service Pistol Matches at Camp Perry and hell I never been there either, I always thought Bullseye was for the old guys... Well it turns out I became old not to long ago.
I'm trying to develop a structured Dryfire & Livefire practice program but I'm struggling on what to work on. I can keep them in the black at 25 "most" of the time but its not like I'm break 85's on Rapids and Timed. The onehanded shooting this still pretty new to me, hard to rip my offhand off that pistol.
One of my issues is I don't know if I really have the correct shooting form either. Seen all the youtube vids of Zins and AMU talk about it and pretty much built my stance from that. 'vertical with shooting lane, offhand in pocket body relaxed but shooting arm stiff, gun pointing to target with a stiff handshake grip' I would say my hold is pretty tight but there are times when I brake a shot, called it good but actually tossed in the white somewhere, its never consistent but it "feels" consistent is the best way I can put it.
I'm going to see if the ARMU can take me out for the week at Perry in July just so I can experience the full match. But prior to that I want to make sure I do every damn thing prior, but this is where I need help to understand what and how I should practice.
Current gear (using for bullseye)
Sig P210, that will need some work on the trigger.
S&W 41
STI 2011 Edge in .45 that shoots lights out. (needs trigger work to bring up the weight.)
What do you all suggest that I can work on?
Docmedic- Posts : 15
Join date : 2022-09-19
Age : 42
Location : Fort Carson
Re: Times getting short, I want to get a P100 tab before I retire.
1911a145 wrote:Nobody likes ISSF shootersjohn bickar wrote:USOPTC, though.Docmedic wrote:Fort Carson, Colorado.Wobbley wrote:https://www.bullseyeforum.net/t5966-usmc-pistol-team-workbook
I’m working through it myself. If I may, can you identify the base or installation you’re currently serving in? That might help to identify other opportunities.
I'll be amazed if you find anything bullseye here. We are pretty deep in USPSA/ IDPA/ multi-gun here.
It's not Bullseye, but you will never find amore wretched hive of scum and villainybetter opportunity to improve your one-handed shooting skills.
There is a lot of crossover between ISSF-style shooting and Bullseye. Take advantage of that opportunity while you are so close.
You might learn something. I will warn you that ISSF disciplines are HFW.
No, nobody likes you.
Except my dog.
john bickar- Posts : 2227
Join date : 2011-07-09
Age : 100
Location : Menlo Park, CA
Re: Times getting short, I want to get a P100 tab before I retire.
I think we can all agree that nobody likes International shooters, everybody likes dogs, and we’re still on the fence about Matt.john bickar wrote:1911a145 wrote:Nobody likes ISSF shootersjohn bickar wrote:USOPTC, though.Docmedic wrote:Fort Carson, Colorado.Wobbley wrote:https://www.bullseyeforum.net/t5966-usmc-pistol-team-workbook
I’m working through it myself. If I may, can you identify the base or installation you’re currently serving in? That might help to identify other opportunities.
I'll be amazed if you find anything bullseye here. We are pretty deep in USPSA/ IDPA/ multi-gun here.
It's not Bullseye, but you will never find amore wretched hive of scum and villainybetter opportunity to improve your one-handed shooting skills.
There is a lot of crossover between ISSF-style shooting and Bullseye. Take advantage of that opportunity while you are so close.
You might learn something. I will warn you that ISSF disciplines are HFW.
No, nobody likes you.
Except my dog.
Brian Mason- Posts : 51
Join date : 2011-06-12
Location : CA
Re: Times getting short, I want to get a P100 tab before I retire.
Brian Mason wrote:I think we can all agree that nobody likes International shooters, everybody likes dogs, and we’re still on the fence about Matt.john bickar wrote:1911a145 wrote:
Nobody likes ISSF shooters
No, nobody likes you.
Except my dog.
Excuse me, sir, but ISSF shooters are quite well-liked. Are you a Distingished Rifleman? Are you Double Distinguished? Are you my dog?
I thought not. This portion of the conversation is between me, 1911a145, and a dog who shall remain nameless, only, and your opinions are invalid.
To connect back to the OP's concern: my dog (I just asked him) wholeheartedly supports your efforts to earn the P100 tab. Fully 2/3 of the above snark-fest did so this year, and 100% (including the dog) wish you the best on your journey.
john bickar- Posts : 2227
Join date : 2011-07-09
Age : 100
Location : Menlo Park, CA
Re: Times getting short, I want to get a P100 tab before I retire.
Congrats on your first trip to Perry! This year was my second, and even as a 125 lb woman had zero issues with a tired arm even by the end of the week. My training routine includes a 20 min calisthenics routine 3 times/week, isometric exercises to build arm/shoulder strength 3+ times/week, grip strength exercises plus 45 min aerobic workout 4+ times/week. Shooting practice includes dry fire with my 45 several days/week. Live fire 5 times/week almost exclusively with the 45; generally 80-120 rounds per 2.5-3 hr session. Didn't quite make P-100 this year - 4 points off, placing 109. Next year...Docmedic wrote:Alright just got back from Perry for the first time, I shot the 2700 with 22, 9mil, and 45. Both the 900s for 22 and 9mm went relatively well since I never shot a full course of fire for bullseye ever. Scoring 789 and 741 respectively, unfortunately the 45 was a different story with a score of 677.
By the time I got to the 45 900, I had already shot the SAFS M9 match, two 900s, 22 EIC, Revo EIC and two team matches plus I had a strange feeling that my Sig 1911 didn't like the 185JHP from AA, also I had to hold the pistol different with a 6o'clock hold due to the rear sight was bottom out at 50. Honestly I thought it was the pistol so I decided to shoot the 9mm at P100 and NTI, what I realize though after having 3 days worth of matches plus a long day of practice prior the muscles in my right arm were tiring and I was over muscling the gun to keep it on target. Several shots where I thought I called good on the 9mm was off target or surprise! low left. I just couldn't keep my arm steady enough as I pulled the trigger strait back. I won't post the P100 or my NTI as they were not great, I believe I actually had 2 off paper misses on both matches which sucked but it is what it is.
Pistol I used for the matches.
SW41 -22LR
SA1911 RO Target 9mm, Sig P210 Target 9mm, Staccato 2011
SW627 Performance for revolver
Sig Sauer 1911 STX - .45
22 went far better then the other two guns due to me shooting that the most prior to going out to Perry, I must had shot anywhere between 300-500 rounds a week a month prior to Nationals. Sig P210 shot well for me but I had to keep taking it back to my work bench to tweak it to get the trigger at 4lbs. As I was heading out to perry I found a used SA 1911 RO target 9mm for 550, so ended up picking it up as I was heading out there. As mention above the Sig 1911 rear sight (adjustable low novak sight) was bottom out at 50 with 185HP's and there was no way to fix that problem when I got there as I didn't have the ammo available till I got on ground so I had to work what I had.
Big take aways that i got for my first year shooting this match,
1. Arm conditioning, I was amazed how tired my muscles in my right arm got after spending 4-5 days shooting. I was squeezing extra hard at the end of the week just to try to keep steady and that didn't work at all.
2. Ammo selection, the 115JHP shot great out of both the P210 and 1911 at the 25 yard line, but I don't think that was the case at 50. I didn't have anytime to actually go test the Sig out to 50 to see what it is doing and that was my mistake, and to use a gun I just bought two days prior to the match with ZERO data was probably not a great idea but I figure since I had it, and I had a strong idea that I wasn't going to get P100 this year I wanted to see how it shot under match conditions. I had zero data on the 45 Ammo I was using for the Sig and it showed horribly.
3. Know how Alibies work, during .22 EIC I had a light strike on the 3rd round of Timed fire. So I raised my hand RO came by, told him I jammed up, I was told to go ahead and put the gun on the table, and I went USPSA brained and cleared the gun and got ready for the next string... So no Alibi granted and saved 3 shots at Timed fired which sank my EIC score.
Overall I think this should be achievable by next year if I put the practice in, I'm really fighting myself not to spend money and get a RRA or Accuracy X pistol like most of the guys on the team have. The biggest issue right now is I need to pick a pistol and stick with it, while it was fun to shoot all the guns I brought I can tell by doing that there is no good way to get better if I don't lock down on one gun.
Completely agree with your assessment to focus on training with one centerfire gun. The M41 will likely take care of itself.
Barbara
targetbarb- Posts : 57
Join date : 2023-05-26
Location : SoCal
Chase Turner likes this post
Re: Times getting short, I want to get a P100 tab before I retire.
targetbarb wrote:Congrats on your first trip to Perry! This year was my second, and even as a 125 lb woman had zero issues with a tired arm even by the end of the week. My training routine includes a 20 min calisthenics routine 3 times/week, isometric exercises to build arm/shoulder strength 3+ times/week, grip strength exercises plus 45 min aerobic workout 4+ times/week. Shooting practice includes dry fire with my 45 several days/week. Live fire 5 times/week almost exclusively with the 45; generally 80-120 rounds per 2.5-3 hr session. Didn't quite make P-100 this year - 4 points off, placing 109. Next year...Docmedic wrote:Alright just got back from Perry for the first time, I shot the 2700 with 22, 9mil, and 45. Both the 900s for 22 and 9mm went relatively well since I never shot a full course of fire for bullseye ever. Scoring 789 and 741 respectively, unfortunately the 45 was a different story with a score of 677.
By the time I got to the 45 900, I had already shot the SAFS M9 match, two 900s, 22 EIC, Revo EIC and two team matches plus I had a strange feeling that my Sig 1911 didn't like the 185JHP from AA, also I had to hold the pistol different with a 6o'clock hold due to the rear sight was bottom out at 50. Honestly I thought it was the pistol so I decided to shoot the 9mm at P100 and NTI, what I realize though after having 3 days worth of matches plus a long day of practice prior the muscles in my right arm were tiring and I was over muscling the gun to keep it on target. Several shots where I thought I called good on the 9mm was off target or surprise! low left. I just couldn't keep my arm steady enough as I pulled the trigger strait back. I won't post the P100 or my NTI as they were not great, I believe I actually had 2 off paper misses on both matches which sucked but it is what it is.
Pistol I used for the matches.
SW41 -22LR
SA1911 RO Target 9mm, Sig P210 Target 9mm, Staccato 2011
SW627 Performance for revolver
Sig Sauer 1911 STX - .45
22 went far better then the other two guns due to me shooting that the most prior to going out to Perry, I must had shot anywhere between 300-500 rounds a week a month prior to Nationals. Sig P210 shot well for me but I had to keep taking it back to my work bench to tweak it to get the trigger at 4lbs. As I was heading out to perry I found a used SA 1911 RO target 9mm for 550, so ended up picking it up as I was heading out there. As mention above the Sig 1911 rear sight (adjustable low novak sight) was bottom out at 50 with 185HP's and there was no way to fix that problem when I got there as I didn't have the ammo available till I got on ground so I had to work what I had.
Big take aways that i got for my first year shooting this match,
1. Arm conditioning, I was amazed how tired my muscles in my right arm got after spending 4-5 days shooting. I was squeezing extra hard at the end of the week just to try to keep steady and that didn't work at all.
2. Ammo selection, the 115JHP shot great out of both the P210 and 1911 at the 25 yard line, but I don't think that was the case at 50. I didn't have anytime to actually go test the Sig out to 50 to see what it is doing and that was my mistake, and to use a gun I just bought two days prior to the match with ZERO data was probably not a great idea but I figure since I had it, and I had a strong idea that I wasn't going to get P100 this year I wanted to see how it shot under match conditions. I had zero data on the 45 Ammo I was using for the Sig and it showed horribly.
3. Know how Alibies work, during .22 EIC I had a light strike on the 3rd round of Timed fire. So I raised my hand RO came by, told him I jammed up, I was told to go ahead and put the gun on the table, and I went USPSA brained and cleared the gun and got ready for the next string... So no Alibi granted and saved 3 shots at Timed fired which sank my EIC score.
Overall I think this should be achievable by next year if I put the practice in, I'm really fighting myself not to spend money and get a RRA or Accuracy X pistol like most of the guys on the team have. The biggest issue right now is I need to pick a pistol and stick with it, while it was fun to shoot all the guns I brought I can tell by doing that there is no good way to get better if I don't lock down on one gun.
Completely agree with your assessment to focus on training with one centerfire gun. The M41 will likely take care of itself.
Barbara
Barb,
You sound like a person who is doing al the right things to ensure you are in good physical shape to handle whichever pistol you choose.
You might want to look up Roxanne Conrad (USMC) and Kim Dyer (USA) both of whom did VERY well at Perry. As I recall they were both
about the same size as you.
Keep shooting - Keep coming back - And above all, ENJOY YOURSELF!
Mike
mbmshooter- Posts : 247
Join date : 2011-06-11
Location : Prescott, Arizona
john bickar and targetbarb like this post
Re: Times getting short, I want to get a P100 tab before I retire.
Barbara has about the same build I had the first time I made P100 (LOL, but also true story).
In addition to her physical fitness, Barbara neglected to mention her mental fitness. She acquitted herself well in the National Trophy Team match, firing almost the same score as she did in the NTI, as the team's Tyro.
I'm not pointing fingers, but at least one other team member would have done well to follow her example![:rolling_eyes: 🙄](https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/emojione/assets/png/1f644.png?v=2.2.7)
It was a pleasure shooting with you. We'll get 'em next year.
In addition to her physical fitness, Barbara neglected to mention her mental fitness. She acquitted herself well in the National Trophy Team match, firing almost the same score as she did in the NTI, as the team's Tyro.
I'm not pointing fingers, but at least one other team member would have done well to follow her example
![:rolling_eyes: 🙄](https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/emojione/assets/png/1f644.png?v=2.2.7)
It was a pleasure shooting with you. We'll get 'em next year.
john bickar- Posts : 2227
Join date : 2011-07-09
Age : 100
Location : Menlo Park, CA
mbmshooter and targetbarb like this post
Re: Times getting short, I want to get a P100 tab before I retire.
Congrats on your first trip to Perry! This year was my second, and even as a 125 lb woman had zero issues with a tired arm even by the end of the week. My training routine includes a 20 min calisthenics routine 3 times/week, isometric exercises to build arm/shoulder strength 3+ times/week, grip strength exercises plus 45 min aerobic workout 4+ times/week. Shooting practice includes dry fire with my 45 several days/week. Live fire 5 times/week almost exclusively with the 45; generally 80-120 rounds per 2.5-3 hr session. Didn't quite make P-100 this year - 4 points off, placing 109. Next year...
Completely agree with your assessment to focus on training with one centerfire gun. The M41 will likely take care of itself.
Barbara
Where do you get the time for that?
I feel like such a slug!
Thought l saw you but we didn’t get a chat
Completely agree with your assessment to focus on training with one centerfire gun. The M41 will likely take care of itself.
Barbara
Where do you get the time for that?
I feel like such a slug!
Thought l saw you but we didn’t get a chat
Re: Times getting short, I want to get a P100 tab before I retire.
Bruce; not much else was going on for the few months before Perry! Thankfully I'm retired. Yes, I saw you too - it seemed you were focused on getting somewhere and so was I. We can connect next year.bruce martindale wrote:Congrats on your first trip to Perry! This year was my second, and even as a 125 lb woman had zero issues with a tired arm even by the end of the week. My training routine includes a 20 min calisthenics routine 3 times/week, isometric exercises to build arm/shoulder strength 3+ times/week, grip strength exercises plus 45 min aerobic workout 4+ times/week. Shooting practice includes dry fire with my 45 several days/week. Live fire 5 times/week almost exclusively with the 45; generally 80-120 rounds per 2.5-3 hr session. Didn't quite make P-100 this year - 4 points off, placing 109. Next year...
Completely agree with your assessment to focus on training with one centerfire gun. The M41 will likely take care of itself.
Barbara
Where do you get the time for that?
I feel like such a slug!
Thought l saw you but we didn’t get a chat
Barbara
targetbarb- Posts : 57
Join date : 2023-05-26
Location : SoCal
chopper likes this post
Re: Times getting short, I want to get a P100 tab before I retire.
For the OP, I emphasized an important aspect that is overlooked. This year in particular the conditions for P100/NTI/NTT were insanely good, yet even some of the heavy hitters in the game had some struggles.john bickar wrote:Barbara has about the same build I had the first time I made P100 (LOL, but also true story).
In addition to her physical fitness, Barbara neglected to mention her mental fitness. She acquitted herself well in the National Trophy Team match, firing almost the same score as she did in the NTI, as the team's Tyro.
I'm not pointing fingers, but at least one other team member would have done well to follow her example
It was a pleasure shooting with you. We'll get 'em next year.
If P100 is your goal, don't over complicate the path.
Unrelated to original topic,
It was fun shooting next to (ish) the California Team in the NTT, good people.
chiz1180- Posts : 1413
Join date : 2019-05-29
Location : Ohio
john bickar and targetbarb like this post
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