Revolver grip techniques - looking for input on grip and trigger finger placement

I consider revolver shooting to be a lot of fun and participate in every DR match I can.  Over the course of many rounds of live fire and squeezes of dry fire and with the testing of a few different guns I've adopted a trigger technique that is distinctly different from my other pistols; I wrap the tip of the index all the way around the left until it contacts the frame and then pull straight back with the outer (tipmost) pad of the second finger bone.  I understand that doctrinally it may not be best but it provides the best sight control and most consistent pull.

For wheel gun shooters: 

1) How much thumb pressure are you applying on the left side of the stocks?

2) Do you similarly wrap the trigger finger around the trigger?

3) In sustained fire, I find that the grip must change slightly as the hammer throw requires a slight pivot to the right of the grip for my thumb to reach the hammer.  Do you find the same thing? 

Finger/hand size may be important to mention, I've seen images of folks whose pinky finger rests on the bottom of the target stock and as my hands are done growing, that will never be a grip I can adopt.

On a DR grip when thumbing the hammer, the amount of wrap by the middle, ring and pinky fingers along with relative hand and grip size lead to every other detail.  Then it becomes whatever you can make work.

Likely unorthodox for BE revo shooters, but my grip is the same for SA as it is for DA. I only shoot SA at SF. I prefer as high a grip as I can get on the frame and as much trigger finger as I can get on the trigger, which enables me to pull it straight to the rear.

I shoot DA for TF and RF. During slow fire, for comfort, I use the other hand to cock the hammer. That way the grip does not have to change. IOW, my grip is what works for DA. Since hammer breaks when the trigger is to the rear, then that grip works for SA too. Again, I shoot DA during TF and RF. Did I say, firm grip yet? Tighter the grip, the tighter the group when shooting DA.

I can only tell you my experience. When I started shooting my model 586, I was shooting slow real well but could not control it in timed and rapid. I figured out what I was doing wrong, which was trying to hold it like my 1911 so my trigger finger was positioned the same way. I figured out you need to shoot any gun the way that gun wants to be shot. I got my hand up higher on the gun so the webbing of my hand was at the high point on the grip where you have the angle change on the grip. With a Hogue grip on it, my finger actually went in far enough the I was shooting with the center of my middle digit. When I completed the trigger pull, my trigger finger actually came in contact with my thumb. I was then able to control the gun in double action and have earned a couple legs shooting it like that. Once I practiced it, it felt as natural as shooting my 1911 or any other gun. I have since added a larger grip which has moved my trigger finger out to a more comfortable and natural spot but I still get my hand up on the grip like before.

Allgoodhits wrote:I shoot DA for TF and RF. During slow fire, for comfort, I use the other hand to cock the hammer. 

I do the same.  Do you single load?  In other words do you have a favorite cylinder?

This is from my edition of The Pistol Shooters Treasury and the article by Paul B Weston on Police Pistol Combat Shooting when it was conducted with revolvers. Note the grip and trigger finger placement.

I could have saved a buck or two on ammo, had I seen that picture 3 years ago when I started shooting revolver.  

That said, this helps me not think I'm so crazy, thank you. 

Does that book talk at all about thumb/heel/finger pressure on the stocks?

Pictures are worth a thousand words. Here are a couple of pictures (accompanied by some words) from Paul Weston's book "Target Shooting Today", which deals with revolver shooting. (Of course, "Today" is relative, as the book was published back in 1950 )

Clearly, Paul Weston was a proponent of using single action in target shooting - both slow and sustained fire. The pictures deal with gripping the revolver for cocking the hammer with the shooter's thumb.

A video I watch a couple of times a year. Here is the part on grip and finger placement.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I-t2qCJ74fI

When a guy shoots 1499 X's of a possible 1500 during a match, I figured he might be worth watching.

DA/SA wrote:A video I watch a couple of times a year. Here is the part on grip and finger placement.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I-t2qCJ74fI

When a guy shoots 1499 X's of a possible 1500 during a match, I figured he might be worth watching.

John's a good friend of mine, as I have known him, shot with and against many times in PPC and at Bianchi since the late 70's. The Lenny McGill video misstated the 1499 X. There are only 150 shots, so 150 X would be perfection. The 1499 was the numerical score, not the X count. Regardless, there have only been three people to ever shoot 1500 in a registered match. The first was another good friend of mine. The late Jim Collins, an Alabama Trooper. Jim shot a 1499-137X, then beat that with a 1500-126X. I do not recall, what the X count was when Pride shot his 1500. Later Phil Hemphill of Mississippi Hwy Patrol shot a 1500. I think the X count was about 119. My PB was 1496 and I did that twice. In recent years Rob Vadasz of US Border Patrol has been dominant. He may have shot a 1500 now in registered match. I am sure, he has done it in practice, probably many times.

I remember one year at the Nationals, I think it was Ed Nixon shot a 599 Match 5. Our NMC match, and he finished with a I think a 1493. Everyone was congratulating him for winning the Nationals. What they had not counted on was Collins had not yet shot, but he had to shoot a 600 to beat Nixon. Well that wasn't going to happen, especially, at Jackson. Collins shot a 600!

I don't know if Pride ever shot much BE. Collins definitely did, and we know Hemphill does. Good shooting is good shooting, most of the best can crossover and run with the biggest dogs, at least as long as they stay in the precision world, and not so much the speed world.

Thanks for the clarification on that!

Wish more people w/could shoot PPC, lots of lost knowledge there.

Joe Morgan wrote:Wish more people w/could shoot PPC, lots of lost knowledge there.

I'd love to, but not sure where to start.

adminbot1911 wrote:

Allgoodhits wrote:I shoot DA for TF and RF. During slow fire, for comfort, I use the other hand to cock the hammer. 

I do the same.  Do you single load?  In other words do you have a favorite cylinder?

I load, I shoot. If the gun indexes and locks up properly AND the cylinder face has been squared to the barrel, then the variation among charge holes should only be limited to whether or not one charge hole may be slightly larger. Even that would be negligible. Typically, unless the throat, crown or barrel are bad, if the gun indexes properly, locks up properly and the cylinder face is true, those are the accuracy enhancers on a revo.

PPC matches are not as common as they once were in the NoVA area. There was a time you could shoot in Manassas, Orange, Richmond, Virginia Beach, Petersburg, Roanoke, Beltsville, Frederick, Sudlersville and more just a tad further away.

Here is a place you may want to check out.

http://www.pashootingevents.org/event/police-pistol-combat-matches-lebanon-pa/2019-08-24/ 

Cheers,

MJ

I had a S&W 19 snubbie in the past.  Got rid of for blinding muzzle flash reasons and the design at the cylinder pivot.  However being a round butt (the gun, not me:)  the gun did very well as a thumb cocker when fit with the Hogue Monogrip for round butt.  It is a very skinny grip that you can really wrap around and free up your thumb.

I love shooting my revolvers for BE.  A lot of fun.  My approach is somewhat different.  I shoot single action for timed and rapid.  My shots are more accurate in single action.  It does take a bit of practice, but it's not hard to master.  The grip plays an important role.  I prefer a rubber Pachmayr grip which gives your thumb more room to cock the hammer back and provides added traction for your hand.  My trigger finger is placed the same as with all my bullseye guns - middle of the first pad.  My thumb is touching the outside of my middle finger while gripping the gun.  I seem to get much fewer "thumbed" shots on the right side of the target that way.  Just what works for me.  YMMV.

oldsalt444 wrote:I love shooting my revolvers for BE.  A lot of fun.  My approach is somewhat different.  I shoot single action for timed and rapid.  My shots are more accurate in single action.  It does take a bit of practice, but it's not hard to master.  The grip plays an important role.  I prefer a rubber Pachmayr grip which gives your thumb more room to cock the hammer back and provides added traction for your hand.

I'd be willing to try the Pachmayr grip, but found that in general I prefer wood to rubber for SA shooting.  The heel of my thumb is rather thick and my thumb is about average or less than average length which means that effort is required to make a solid throw when thumbing the hammer.

A model 14/15/17 with target hammer is exactly the right length for my thumb to reach with few issues.  Nice sharp serrations too. 

A model 14/15/17/686 with non-target or fishhook hammer requires a pivot on the heel of the palm which is easier done with the smooth wood than the grippy rubber.

Thumbing the hammer on a Ruger GP100 requires full-blown stretch of the thumb to what feels like the rear sight blade to get the leverage to cock for the next SA shot.  Don't want to go soft on it, either, or risk advancing the cylinder without the hammer being cocked (and setting yourself up for a saved round).

And it is all great fun.

This picture shows how I grip the revolver. I shoot slow fire SA, and for timed and rapid I start with the hammer cocked and shoot the 4 remaining shots DA. I agree with MJ about cocking with the opposite hand so my grip doesn't change.

I shoot all SA so I never really bring my thumb all the way down. there is contact in the web but I let the middle and ring finger do all the gripping. Pretty much the same as my 1911 grip.

I shoot revolver with a high grip, thumb on 3rd finger with minimal pressure. Pressure is applied by 3rd and 4th fingers. SA for slow fire and DA for timed and rapid. I use Herrett Shooting Star skip checkered grips. Trigger finger is on trigger just in front of the first first knuckle crease. Narrow serated trigger.

orpheoet wrote:I shoot revolver with a high grip, thumb on 3rd finger with minimal pressure. Pressure is applied by 3rd and 4th fingers. SA for slow fire and DA for timed and rapid. I use Herrett Shooting Star skip checkered grips. Trigger finger is on trigger just in front of the first first knuckle crease. Narrow serated trigger.

Good description.  For DA TF, trigger finger is just in front of the first knuckle crease, meaning the 2nd knuckle or the finger tip?  Trying to figure out how you'd get leverage to operate DA with the fingertip.

Basically the same position as on 1911. Right in front of first crease.

V

From Len V