Any tips for Brazos DEWC use?

I'm considering trying the Brazos 148gr .358 coated DEWC for low cost centerfire cartridge shooting. I have a nearby indoor 25 yard range, a good supply of WST and Bullseye, and I like that it drops the Alox part out of reloading process. Brass on hand is plated Remington, unplated Winchester and Starline.

My current 38 Special load is 2.7gr of WST and a Magnus 514 HBWC. I use this in a S&W M52 and revolvers.

Does anyone have experience with these bullets and suggestions on loading them?

Your good

The bullets and loads are somewhat interchangeable.  So swap one for the other.  You can go up or down a tenth of a grain to see if it improves something, but likely it won’t mean much.

So the ammo faerie arrived today and I ran out to meet the USPS van as I knew it was a heavy package and the drivers are running Code Red. I had placed my order after the replies and the processing and shipping worked out fine. The bullets were packed in bags, the bags were packed in foam, and the shipment was in a box inside a USPS box. Nice bullet handling.

I like the product so far as casting, coating and low weight deviation for castings. The weight deviation champ on my bench as still my 45-45-10 coated Magnus 514 swaged HBWCs but that is to be expected.

So, my plan is to finish up my 600 or so Magnus 514s for the S&W M52 and then shift my Dillon SDB to the Brazos loaded a little longer for just revolvers, Maybe 2.8 WST and taper crimp at the top lube groove. This should be a fun 25 yard load and my Lewis Lead Remover will get more lonely.

I looked at the Brazo bullets online. The 148 wadcutters are button tip bullets. How does this work out in Smith and Wesson Model 52 magazines?  I have to load my double end wadcutters completely flush with the case mouth to fit in my 52 mags.

You can always seat them backwards for the 52.

For me, they do shoot better backwards.

I am just starting to get together everything needed to load
for a 52-2 I recently purchased.
I got 3000 HBWC and 1000 DEWC bullets.
I expect the hollow base bullets are longer as the weight is the same.
Is there a reason to use one or the other in the 52?
G

I always get better accuracy from Hollow  base.

David

You’ll get better accuracy from the HB. But if your just practicing or doing drills the DEWC are just fine.  Use the very same load.  The HB, as you described, do protrude more into the case, but there is an air pocket in the base of the bullet so the loading density is identical.  However, the GB is made of softer and weaker lead so if you drive them too hard, you can blow the head off and the skirt can stick in the barrel.  So don’t exceed loads tested in autoloaders like the S&W52.  A word of caution about the Red Dot load, I WOULD NOT exceed 2.9 (which is an accurate load) as the burning rate of Red Dot is faster than Bullseye and pressures can spike.

I found this thread at http://castboolits.gunloads.com/ interesting. In the thread there is this graphic: 



I plan to load my revolver loads using the Brazos bullets at the top cannelure with 2.8 WST.

Like this from www.glocktalk.com/threads/soft-shooting-38-sp-load.1796452/: 

I load those coated  Button nose wadcutters up to max for defense in my little airweight 38.  Using Lyman manual, I have found some good loads.  They shoot the same no matter how fast I drive them.    I would NEVER use that much bullseye as in the picture above.  

They shoot great out of my 4" K frame too.   

I use them for the first cylinder full in steel bowling pin shooting.  If I need a reload, I have to go to round nose in the speed loader.

I load them at target velocities for practice and plinking.   I do not have a model 52.  

Have fun
David

Well...(as a co-worker and former A320 instructor from Minnesota would say) ... I finished my Magnus 514s, cleaned all the built up Alox off my seater, and loaded 100ish Brazos with 2.8gr WST in Federal brass.

I have a custom powder drop for my Dillon SDB for swaged HBWC and use 38 Super sizing dies to not size as small as 38 Special. One of the first things I noticed was the Brazos DEWC fit maybe too loosely in the Federal brass. Since I taper crimped at 0.370" on the top cannelure of the Brazos DEWC I wasn't too concerned with set back and if I was careful and not push in the bullet too much, the seater would position the bullet properly. I shot these today in an old slick action S&W M64-3 and they shot fine at 25 yards, on call but not as tight as 22 groupings.

However, being concerned about neck tension and being on reduced pay, I played around with my available dies and think my next batch will be my stash of Starline brass and a 38 Special sizing die in the SDB. I mocked one up and the neck tension was tighter for the Brazos cast and coated bullet.

Below is a comparison between how I load HBWC for S&W M52 and revolvers, and the Brazos loading for revolvers.





Again, the point of this exercise is to have a useful 25 yard revolver load for practice indoors for a little more fun than shooting 22s. I'd also like to master Double Action shooting in a cost effective manner. Not chasing brass is a plus. I have a large amount of primers and powder and the Brazos seem high quality and good value.

Stephen

By the way, what is the powder Eley uses in their 22s? For aromatherapy purposes it smells really good. Most powders don't smell very good when burned.

The target above was shot today with a S&W M14-3 two handed Slow Fire at 25 yards, one cylinder. It took a while to warm up and my one handed grip was not consistent so I tried two hands. My coach would probably say this was the target I flinched inward on instead of outward. However, I think the 2.8 WST load and the tighter neck of using a 38 Special sizing die worked out to give good performance at 25 yards indoors at a 22 price. The barrel is clean other than powder residue.

"By the way, what is the powder Eley uses in their 22s? For aromatherapy purposes it smells really good. Most powders don't smell very good when burned."

I think the nice smell is from the priming compound. The "Eley Primed" Aguila smell the same.

Kp321 wrote:"By the way, what is the powder Eley uses in their 22s? For aromatherapy purposes it smells really good. Most powders don't smell very good when burned."

I think the nice smell is from the priming compound. The "Eley Primed" Aguila smell the same.

Well... there was this press release from Eley on April 1st a few years ago:

Model 52 loading:
Seat bullet so shoulder is just below the case mouth.
Always crimp with a Redding Profile Crimp die and roll the case mouth over the bullet shoulder just enough that only brass will contact the feed ramp. Do not over crimp.
Plated bullets will give you 3-12" groups at 25 yards.
Cast bullets will give you 2-6" groups at 25 yards.
Best bullets have been L-HBWCs, with the unavailable Remington bullets being the best of the best. Remington bullets will very seldom group over 1.5" at 25 yards, unless you do something wrong loading it. Presently, when I run out of Remington, I will be testing Zero, Precision Delta, and, maybe, Magnus swaged HBWCs. Speer and Hornady have been more then useless and fall close to my results with cast bullets.
Best accuracy is using cases unsized (or just sized enough to hold the bullet). The slide will finish chambering the round.
Get a seating stem that only contacts the shoulder and does not touch the button nose. Lee will do this very inexpensively. This seating stem will also work great for SWCs, though you should order one expressly for SWCs and then use it for your WCs (my custom WC seating stem "wall" thickness so too large to use with SWC bullets.
Be sure to use enough case mouth flare so the bullet starts off well in the case and does not tip. Hornady seating dies, with the sliding sleeve, work very well to keep the WC aligned.
After seating and crimping, pull bullet and ensure that the diameter has NOT changed diameter.
Bullet, particularly at the skirt, should be at least 0.360".

noylj,

With unsized brass how do you get rid of the S&W bulge in the brass that is near the rim? I size my brass in a 38 Super/Auto sizer to get rid of the bulge or else I can't use the brass in a Colt revolver. The 38 Super/Auto sizer works with a custom oversize powder drop so swaged Magnus 514 can keep their size. I had to go to a 38 Special sizer to keep the Brazos DEWC from falling in too far.

Also, I had one button nose Brazos DEWC that fell in the case too far and is flush loaded. Is that still a safe load to shoot or did the pressure from the small powder space go up too far, since the DEWC does not have the open area of the HBWC skirt?

So long as the powder charge is within those specified for Model 52 and HBWC, if the DEWC is seated flush it should be no issue.  148 grains of lead only occupies so much volume.  The HBWC bullets are longer but they have a hollow base...so the loading density is identical.

>With unsized brass how do you get rid of the S&W bulge in the brass that is near the rim?


I don't. My M52 rounds only work in semi-autos. The revolver (and custom Bar-to barrels for the M52) are chambered too tight.
I'm working on accuracy, and not universal loading.

If the bullet has fallen into the case, pressure will be quite a bit higher if fired.
The best wadcutters I have found are at least 0.359" in diameter, and 0.360" is better.
Do not exceed 750fps with HBWC bullets as the skirt pressure against the bore can be more than the tensile strength of the lead and the skirt can be ripped from the rest of the bullet. You'll either have two holes in the target or a barrel obstruction.
650-725fps is the target velocity in any barrel length.
If you load a HBWC backwards, you have severely reduced the internal volume and had better know how to work up your loads from well UNDER any start load.