Walther Gsp

I've been shooting the model 41 for a while now and I'm ready to move to the next level. I'm considering the Walther Gsp and would like to get some opinions .

A guy at my club has one that I think is as old as me. It must have seen 100k rounds... It's very reliable and he claims not to have had a malfunction since he got it. He shot 4-5 cases through it.

Some people don't like the balance, i.e. nose heavy. Other than that, I haven't heard of anything bad. All that being said, the Pardini, FWB and Hammerli 208s seem to be much more popular.

The walthers are awesome guns!

So are the benellis, the fwb's, and the hammerli's

Just do not overlook the pardini! 

I was able to shoot and compare all these pistols before I selected the pardini. 

Shooting side by side by side was very illuminating. 

Regards,
Crankster

I've been shooting my GSP Expert three full years of indoor league and some NRA matches indoors and out. Never had any type of jam. Have only had 2 rounds that didn't go bang. Both were duds. One was a CCI SV and the other an Eley Club. Only one alibi in 3 years (one of the duds). Know several others with this gun and all have similar reliability. Bench rested, I can shoot one 1/2" hole in the x ring. Not so much when I hold it! LOL

The GSP Expert is not as front heavy as its predecessor and offers damping that absorbs what little recoil there is. I adore my GSP Expert and wholeheartedly recommend it. YMMV.

Swelfelo

Flytrap1 wrote:I've been shooting the model 41 for a while now and I'm ready to move to the next level. I'm considering the Walther Gsp and would like to get some opinions .

The Walther GSP is not a level above a well maintained, and functioning Model 41.

If you are just going to shoot 22. Either gun is fine.    If you want to go to the next level by starting to shoot full 2700's, you might do better to stick with the 41, or switch to a 22 that has the same grip angle as a 1911, and I believe the Model 41 does.   

The Walther GSP does not have that.

Owned, been issued, and shot a M41s, Hammerli 208s, Karts, and Rugers.  Best score to date was with a M41.  Before the new import I'd consider sending that 41 out to have a good tune-up and trigger job.  I'm thinking I'll send my backup 41 to KC this winter for a good going through including a trigger job.

Flytrap1,
I own a model 41, which I have great fondness for, but now I shoot a Pardini SP Bullseye and LOVE IT. When younger I might have sneered at the euro guns but find the Pardini suits me well, fits my hand like a glove, and is the pistol I keep getting personal bests with. Whatever pistol you have confidence in is the pistol you will shoot the best.


I should note that the other reason I love the Pardini is the Bullseye model shoots the 32 ACP, which is much easier to load than the 32 S&W long (a GSP option) and quite accurate. But that is only important if you shoot 2700 matches and are enamored with three calibers.


That said, I shot my former GSP well, but not as well as my Pardini. Also, the GSP is an older design, one that has not been fundamentally improved on since the Expert came out (and some GSP lovers do not like the plastic in the Expert; personally, I still have misgivings about aluminum). Gun owners are if anything, finicky. dipnet

In response to a couple of the above comments:

The GSP Expert does not have the type of grip that requires the wrist to be bent like many other European pistols. 
 
Rather, the GSP Expert is "straight-up" very much like the 1911, as is the FWB AW-93.  

Model 41's can tend to be "finicky".  The GSP Expert is not.  The GSP works without issue with just about any ammo and in just about any weather.   Neither can be said for the 41.

Not sure what plastic parts are on the GSP Expert.  Can't find any on mine anywhere except inside the trigger guard as a filler and not associated with any function of the pistol. Further, the GSP Expert works perfectly as designed so don't understand why it would or should be "updated".

There are several different versions of the GSP.  When I had Dave Wilson make one of his 32 S&W Long barrels for my GSP Expert .32 upper, he was unable to test it because his wife's GSP (GSP-C as I recall) lower would not accept my GSP Expert upper.  In addition to the frame and upper differences, there are 2 different types of triggers.  The Type-2 trigger is adjustable in just about every conceivable manner. 

Accordingly, when discussing the GSP, it is important to distinguish which is the subject of your comments.

Is one better than the other?  The answer you receive is one that is purely subjective on the part of the owner, or pure conjecture on the part of someone without having any experience with one or the other.  

Try both pistols if possible.  

41's are a lot cheaper.  Parts and accessories are readily available for both here in the US.

41's accept several different .22 barrels.  The end result is that it remains a .22 with any barrel you mount.  The GSP Expert has both .22 and .32 S&W Long uppers which means that it can be used for both RF and CF.  Change-out is about 10 seconds.   A consistently accurate 50-yard .32 S&W Long round load is advanced science however.

If you would ever consider a Euro gun for 22 and CF I'd take a hard look at the Pardini  .22/.32ACP bullseye setup.  The .32ACP with the Hornady 60gr XTP bullet is proving to be consistantly accurate at 50 yards.

Interesting comments about the GSP Expert and FWB AW-93 grip angle being similar to the 1911.  The primary reason that I recently sold my Pardini SP was because of finding the transition between different grip angles bothersome.  I'd like to learn more about the FWB AW-93.

That 32 ACP Pardini sounds like fun.  I've got a 32 S&W GSP-C and a 32 S&W Hammerli P240.   Haven't even fired the P240 but played with the Walther a bit.  Got side tracked with my 38 Super stuff.  I'll get back to that 32 bore as soon as I get my scores back where they need to be.   Bet my 32 S&W Dillon SDB will be easy to convert to ACP..

beeser wrote:Interesting comments about the GSP Expert and FWB AW-93 grip angle being similar to the 1911.  The primary reason that I recently sold my Pardini SP was because of finding the transition between different grip angles bothersome.  I'd like to learn more about the FWB AW-93.

beeser
Horton makes a grip with the 1911 angle for the Pardini SP, many bullseye shooters that shoot the Pardini SP also get the Horton grip.  It is an anatomical grip but it does have the 1911 angle so your wrist is in the same position.

- Dave

Good luck getting a Horton Grip. One of the worst experiences I ever had was trying to get a grip from Dick Horton. I was promised a grip and then he ditched my project after repeatedly delaying me because a larger order came in and he felt like he should take care them of first. My favorite excuse was that it was too hot in his workplace to go there.

Avoid him like the plague. Rink and Nill make wonderful grips without the drama.

Swelfelo.

I just shot with 2 Pardini owners last weekend that couldn't say enough good things about ordering and receiving their Horton grips - they are beautiful too. 

I guess your mileage may vary.

Do either Rink or Nil make a 1911 angle grip for the Pardini?  I have a Rink on my LP10e and love it but it is the Euro angle.

- Dave

dronning wrote:

beeser wrote:Interesting comments about the GSP Expert and FWB AW-93 grip angle being similar to the 1911.  The primary reason that I recently sold my Pardini SP was because of finding the transition between different grip angles bothersome.  I'd like to learn more about the FWB AW-93.

beeser
Horton makes a grip with the 1911 angle for the Pardini SP, many bullseye shooters that shoot the Pardini SP also get the Horton grip.  It is an anatomical grip but it does have the 1911 angle so your wrist is in the same position.

- Dave

Whaaat!!!  Don't tell me!  Had I known that the Pardini would still be in my safe or I would be using it.  Stupid me for making an impulsive decision.

Have Horton grips on my AW-93, Clark 38 Super, and Rock River Wadgun.  Great service and product from Horton in each and every instance.

The Pardini .32 ACP is showing great promise which can make it very attractive.  For me it is a grip issue.  Like the GSP and AW-93 tho, very spendy.

CMM makes 1911 grip adapters for the AW-93 as well as having made them for the Hammerli 208S for some time.  They also have a trigger for the AW-93 that replicates the 1911 trigger.  Have one and it is nice.

The thing that I noticed about and the reason that I bought an AW-93 is the balance.  It feels perfect to me.  The trigger has a whole lot of adjustments.  The AW-93 is tried and proven.  The Marine Corps Pistol Team has several.   

I have noticed that at local matches that the Marines are using a lot of the Marvel .22 conversions.  In talking to one of the Senior NCO's, the reason is influenced by finances.  As he told me, you can buy a lot of Marvel conversions for the price of one AW-93.  The conversions are an alternative.  I have a late Marvel and a Nelson.  Very accurate and allows the use of the same frame for bullseye matches or the use of a dedicated frame for the conversion.  REALLY like the Nelson.  Super service as well. 

The Matchguns MG-2 is also very well balanced.  The trigger has a great many adjustments.  Early MG-2's had some growing pains and the reputation suffered.  I have have no problems with mine at all.  Radical design and a real pleasure to shoot.  Grips for the MG-2 will also work on the MG-1 (air pistol).  Probably will work on the MG-4 (.32 S&W Long).  The MG-4 is next on my list of required competition pistols.

The Hammerli 208S is an old favorite but they are getting to be somewhat rare.  Parts are something of a problem too.  That is why I sold mine.

The bottomline is that you can buy 2 or 3 S&W 41's for the price of any of the above pistols, or around a half-dozen of the conversions (without  dedicated 1911 frame).  That may well be a primary factor in deciding which to buy.

I have bought Horton grips for several of my pistols and always had a wonderful experience with Mr Horton. Never any drama.


Virgil

Dear Beeser:

I have a Dick Horton 1911 angle grip with fingergroves on my pardini.  Awesome!

See if you can get your pardini back.

Want to see pictures?

Cranky

CrankyThunder wrote:Dear Beeser:

I have a Dick Horton 1911 angle grip with fingergroves on my pardini.  Awesome!

See if you can get your pardini back.

Want to see pictures?

Cranky

It's already gone to its new owner.  I believe the pics are still posted on TargetTalk.

The stock Pardini grip is adjustable. Just loosen the grip screw and it rotates from Euro to 1911 or anything in between. A ten cent longer screw is needed to get to 1911 or more. This adjustment is not in their low budget manual.

I would like to say that I tend to disagree a bit with the comments on the 208S.  At least in my area, I haven't seen any issues with spare parts, and the pistols are generally available anytime you want one.  A number of the parts are interchangable within the 200 series as well, so don't overlook the standard 208 and 215s, etc. 

Quite often you can see one that's almost unused come out of someone collection from time to time. Usually RoCo or Larry's has one for sale, both vendors service the pistols and both are at Camp Perry supporting shooters.  Most of the supported teams shot them, and a lot still do. 

 Check out the line at the Mayleigh match for types of pistols shot.  The Hammerli is still pretty high on the list for bullseye shooters.  

Just a comment, since I've dry fired and live fired today!

Cecil

I put over 100K rounds through 208. Firing pin broke at around 95k.that was only problem I ever had. Never had an alibi until it broke. I just bought another one after not having one for 20 years.
I really like the GSP as well. Shot a .32 one summer at AMU and put in the neighborhood of 1000 rds a week through it for about 4 months leading up to CISM matches in Switzerland.
I think grip angle is a moot point. Once you get used to a grip angle you just shoot it.
Jon

LOOKING FOR GRIP..